Yoko Ono | Page 14 | Fab Forum | The Beatles Bible

IveJustSeenAFaceo said
I’d say she could be blamed for hooking him on it. Maybe Dylan gave it to him the first time, but I think Yoko made him a legitimate junkie (and really vice versa, John hurt Yoko pretty much as much as Yoko hurt John).

And Into The Sky, I’d go with poisonous.

Let’s see now. Bob Dylan offers John heroin. He does heroin. Yoko Ono offers John heroin. He does heroin. It sounds to me like John wanted to do heroin. I never blamed the convenience store clerk who sold me cigarettes. And yet you people blame Yoko for John’s actions? This is the kind of nonsense I’m talking about. People just blame Yoko because they want to.

Yeah, I think people are basically personally responsible for their own habits – unless they’re held captive, bound in a chair, and forcibly injected with heroin until they’re physically addicted, “French Connection II”-style.

Into the Sky with Diamonds said
@Expert Textpert 

Expert Texpert said, 

“Well, I see one big thing with your post that’s wrong…John claimed Bob Dylan got him high on heroin in 1966, a good two years before he did heroin with Yoko, so I don’t think she can be blamed.

Also, when John (and every other Beatle) turned against Paul, it was because of Paul, not Yoko.  Paul was being sneaky and getting the Eastmans involved, and buying up shares behind John’s back.

As to Julian, there is plenty of evidence that he went on vacations with John and Yoko and visited the Dakota, so I don’t think Julian’s claims of “poor me” are 100% justified, at least while John was alive.  And John admitted that he had less to do with Julian because he was born during Beatlemania and he just had little time for him–so what does that have to do with Yoko?

True, she may not have liked seeing John with Julian because she was separated from her own child–that’s selfish, but I understand it.”

I never blamed the convenience store clerk who sold me cigarettes. And yet you people blame Yoko for John’s actions? This is the kind of nonsense I’m talking about. People just blame Yoko because they want to.

OK, this is a good discussion. These are my thoughts on the above:

As pointed out by Joe, it’s not clear that Dylan introduced him to heroin. I haven’t seen that Dylan-Lennon-heroin before, but even assuming it’s true, it’s pretty clear that Lennon was not an addict until Yoko came around. The fact that he might have had heroin with Dylan is not relevant. For all we know, he might have even had some in Hamburg (not likely). When he hitched up with Yoko, it was either her idea to delve back into heroin – in which case she was the instigator – or it was Lennon’s idea and she was the enabler.

McCartney’s choice of his brother-in-law as a manager was not smart.  But Lennon was no angel either. (Consider his decision to bring Yoko into the studio or to give the Get Back tapes to Spector without consulting the other band members.) Lennon went totally ballistic and for quite a period of time. Perhaps it was drug-fueled anger, but Yoko was his partner in crime. Again, she was the enabler.

Yes, Julian went to the Dakota etc… but every account suggests that he was relatively poorly treated. Just look at Lennon’s will. Did Julian get a fair shake? Expert Texpert, where are the sources suggesting that Julian was perfectly well treated and that he’s just been playing ‘poor me’? (I’ve actually rarely heard him publicly complain.)

The fact that you can understand why Yoko felt the way she did about Julian doesn’t mean it was the right thing. I suppose that’s the difference between an explanation and an excuse.

Of course you wouldn’t blame the convenience store that sold you cigarettes. But if the store owner moved in with you and brought packs of cigarettes, that would be different, right? Or if you were the one who brought in the cigarettes and your partner jumped in and started smoking with you, then he or she would be part of the problem, no?

“This is the kind of nonsense I’m talking about.” What makes another person’s position more nonsense than yours? 

“People just blame Yoko because they want to.” What do you mean by that? You mean for no particular reason? Why would anyone do that? I suppose if you’re Chinese or Korean you might dislike her for the simple reason that she’s Japanese. But I don’t see that as being an issue here. I think that people who dislike her do so for all of the above reasons. If someone thinks she was just standing on the sidelines and had nothing to do with all the negatives surrounding Lennon in the late 60’s and early 70’s, well, you’re entitled to your opinion of course. But I don’t think you can label those who think differently as speaking nonsense.

Joe also said above that it was someone in Paul McCartney ‘s circle who introduced John and Yoko to heroin, so that pretty much shows that it wasn’t Yoko’s fault.  As far as Julian playing poor me, there is a particular video on Youtube where he’s being interviewed on the beach and says that he only saw his father a few times in his whole life, which is not true.  I’ve heard him make other comments in interviews, but I don’t really feel like collecting the sources here.  They are out there and not at all hard to find.

What I find nonsense is that people blame Yoko for hooking John on heroin when there is no evidence for that–and apparently just because they want to.  What we put into our own bodies is our choice.  Yoko didn’t force him to do it.

Well, personally I would miss those Yoko albums that I enjoy so much. Plus, I don’t understand how Yoko’s mere existence negates the Beatles’ achievements. I think the band’s breakup was pretty much inevitable.

Slate article on how Grapefruit inspired “Imagine .”

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A Yoko tribute album called Cut Pieces will be released January 13.

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