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Would John have been knighted too?
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Miss Winters
65 Posts
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27 December 2010 - 6.02am

We all know Paul was knighted by the Queen in 1997, but my question is that whether or not John, if he hadn't been killed, would have been knighted alongside him. Or would he have been knighted instead of Paul? I don't know if there are official sources that could give me this answer or if this just a matter or opinion; so, if there is not an indefinite answer, who do you think deserved knight-hood more? Or did they both deserve it equally? What about George and Ringo - do you think they deserved knight-hood, too?

Sorry for slamming you guys with a bunch of questions. a-hard-days-night-paul-1

Blackbird singing in the dead of night...

_¸.·´¯¯`·-» take these broken wings and learn to fly

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RedLennon
Whitewater WI
194 Posts
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27 December 2010 - 6.06am

Heck yeah i think he would have.  Of course I am heavily biased, but I think George and Reingo both deserved it too!.

Sir Ringo...has a nice ring

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robert
415 Posts
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27 December 2010 - 11.22am

That is an interesting question -

First, I don't think John would have been knighted based on the current path John was on. John had left England (Paul still maintains Britain as his legal residence). For all we know John might have become an American citizen. Paul also has done a lot in England, - a lot charitable work and all those Oratorios etc - all part of the English structure.There's a tape of John calling Paul and Mick Jagger (also Knighted I believe) "company men" - meaning very much part of the system - John was definitely not that!

John's public charity work was performed in the US and after 1975 he stopped doing any public charity and said he would do his giving quietly. So I think the things one is knighted fo,r John would not have "qualified" for - as I understand it. And based on the path he was on, no reason to think that would have changed.

The question I wonder is if John had not been
killed would Paul have been knighted at all?
Here's why I ask
this. Because knighting Paul without John would have created a public outcry - even though John probably would not have qualified for Knighthood. But would the Royals have either capitulated and knighted them both or neither?

And please don't bombard me by telling my how great John was, I love John and believe he was great and would have remained great. I am just saying that as he was becoming more and more Americanized - he qualified less for Knighthood (under the English order).

"She looks more like him than I do."

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Celebrated_Mr_K
155 Posts
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4
27 December 2010 - 2.07pm

He's been canonized.  Doesn't need to be knighted.

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mithveaen
Sitarday's room
4618 Posts
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5
27 December 2010 - 4.38pm

Celebrated_Mr_K said:

He's been canonized.  Doesn't need to be knighted.


LOL!! That reminds me of the review I read about "Two of us" movie : "St John and Sir Paul".

 

I don't think he would have been knighted. As Marcelo says, John was always against authority. He returned his MBE to protest British politics. John  always demostrated his disdain for upper classes, and also, don't forget that Yoko was mistreated by British press, one of the reasons they left. So it would be like "Why should we bother to give him an honor he's not going to accept?".

 

Now had Paul been knighted if John were alive? Yes. I don't think people would have felt angry if John hadn't been knighted, because John wouldn't have wanted this. It might have created a distrance between Paul and John… but we can't be sure.

 

Actually I think if John hadn't been killed the whole history of the Beatles would be very different, so it's (at least to me) difficult to especulate.

Here comes the sun….. Scoobie-doobie……

Something in the way she moves…..attracts me like a cauliflower…

Bop. Bop, cat bop. Go, Johnny, Go.

Beware of Darkness… 

Marcelo
478 Posts
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27 December 2010 - 6.51pm

John being knighted?  I don't think so... (read the "I" in a musical, half minute way)

 

There's no point in speculating about "what if John wasn't killed", except if you are writing a sci-fi novel (that I would love to read).

 

robert said:

And please don't bombard me by telling my how great John was, I love John and believe he was great and would have remained great. I am just saying that as he was becoming more and more Americanized - he qualified less for Knighthood (under the English order).


John was a great artist, but he could be a super-bastard from time to time. He's way too complex to define. I love him the way he is, thou.

I'd like to say "thank you" on behalf of the group and ourselves and I hope we passed the audition.
John Lennon

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Miss Winters
65 Posts
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27 December 2010 - 11.52pm

robert said:

The question I wonder is if John had not been killed would Paul have been knighted at all?

 



I agree with you that John wouldn't have been knighted. And I'm going to have to say Paul still would have been knighted. The Beatles made such an impact on the musical industry, I don't see how one of them couldn't have been knighted and Mick Jagger was. Don't get me wrong, I love Mick Jagger and all, but the Beatles were HUGE and you really can't skip over them just because fans might have been upset about John not being knighted. No doubt, there would be at least a small upcry, but I have a feeling eventually John or the Queen would say something about it to stop it.  

Marcelo said:  

There's no point in speculating about "what if John wasn't killed", except if you are writing a sci-fi novel (that I would love to read).


I know, I know, just interesting to think about. As mith said, a LOT of things would have changed, not just Beatles history, but world history, too.

mithveaen said:  

 It might have created a distrance between Paul and John… but we can't be sure.  

I wouldn't think so. If John was protesting British politics, I don't think he would care if Paul was knighted. I think he'd be happy for Paul and all, but I don't think he'd be particuarly offended.

Okay, I think I'm putting too much thought into this – kind of going against what Marcelo just said about speculating if John lived… we can never be sure what John would have done if he was still alive. But still, all very interesting to think about.

 

**9**


Blackbird singing in the dead of night...

_¸.·´¯¯`·-» take these broken wings and learn to fly

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mithveaen
Sitarday's room
4618 Posts
(Offline)
8
28 December 2010 - 1.06am

Miss Winters said:

I wouldn't think so. If John was protesting British politics, I don't think he would care if Paul was knighted. I think he'd be happy for Paul and all, but I don't think he'd be particuarly offended.

Okay, I think I'm putting too much thought into this – kind of going against what Marcelo just said about speculating if John lived… we can never be sure what John would have done if he was still alive. But still, all very interesting to think about.

 

**9**



I know Miss Winters.. and I know it's fun. The thing is that my Dad used to say "El hubiera es el tiempo favorito de los tontos" = "The If I had is the favorite "tense" of the foolish" just to teach me to never regret too much and wonder "If I had or hadn't....". So I try not to think much on that.

Now as a book or movie would be interesting. I have read some books about history changed (like Fatherland) and they're very, very interesting.

Speaking of that, has anybody seen this one? a-hard-days-night-john-3

 

 

*17*

Here comes the sun….. Scoobie-doobie……

Something in the way she moves…..attracts me like a cauliflower…

Bop. Bop, cat bop. Go, Johnny, Go.

Beware of Darkness… 

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StarWisher
1154 Posts
(Offline)
9
28 December 2010 - 2.25am

Was the crotchety guy at the door supposed to be him? a-hard-days-night-john-2 (Pretty much a rhetorical question, but I'd have loved to have seen John bellow out "Get off my lawn!" I'm sure I'm not the only one. 🙂 )

I'd never heard of this movie. Is it worth a watch?

And I rarely report it, but for this post, kinda fitting I got a 9.

"We are all a little weird and life's a little weird, and when we find someone whose weirdness is compatible with ours, we join up with them and fall in mutual weirdness and call it love." — Dr. Seuss

 

 

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The Walrus
Working for the national health
1024 Posts
(Offline)
10
29 December 2010 - 8.42pm

John was mellowing towards the end of his life. I think, at very least, he would have received an honourary knighthood if he threw away his British passport, and if he didn't (I doubt he would have, it was his license to travel in Europe after all) he'd have been nominated for the full thing, and quite possibly changed his stance, though he would have renounced it at the outbreak of the Iraq war (if not the one in Afghanistan). I doubt it would have happened in 1997, though. Thatcher and Major wouldn't have nominated him, and I think Blair would have been cautious about doing it immediately.

And I neeeeeeeeed her all the time

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mithveaen
Sitarday's room
4618 Posts
(Offline)
11
29 December 2010 - 9.33pm

StarWisher said:

Was the crotchety guy at the door supposed to be him? a-hard-days-night-john-2 (Pretty much a rhetorical question, but I'd have loved to have seen John bellow out "Get off my lawn!" I'm sure I'm not the only one. 🙂 )

I'd never heard of this movie. Is it worth a watch?

And I rarely report it, but for this post, kinda fitting I got a 9.


Nop. In that part, the guy you see inside the door that gets the reporter attention, that's supposed to be John. (that's supposed to be or ... oh well whatever. Please grammar nazis be nice with me today) paul-mccartney

Here comes the sun….. Scoobie-doobie……

Something in the way she moves…..attracts me like a cauliflower…

Bop. Bop, cat bop. Go, Johnny, Go.

Beware of Darkness… 

Avatar
The Walrus
Working for the national health
1024 Posts
(Offline)
12
29 December 2010 - 9.47pm

mithveaen said:

Miss Winters said:

I wouldn't think so. If John was protesting British politics, I don't think he would care if Paul was knighted. I think he'd be happy for Paul and all, but I don't think he'd be particuarly offended.

Okay, I think I'm putting too much thought into this – kind of going against what Marcelo just said about speculating if John lived… we can never be sure what John would have done if he was still alive. But still, all very interesting to think about.

 

**9**



I know Miss Winters.. and I know it's fun. The thing is that my Dad used to say "El hubiera es el tiempo favorito de los tontos" = "The If I had is the favorite "tense" of the foolish" just to teach me to never regret too much and wonder "If I had or hadn't....". So I try not to think much on that.
 

Now as a book or movie would be interesting. I have read some books about history changed (like Fatherland) and they're very, very interesting.

Speaking of that, has anybody seen this one? a-hard-days-night-john-3

 

 

*17*


Am I the only one annoyed that they chose a McCartney composition for the film title?

And I neeeeeeeeed her all the time

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StarWisher
1154 Posts
(Offline)
13
29 December 2010 - 9.48pm

mithveaen said:

StarWisher said:

Was the crotchety guy at the door supposed to be him? a-hard-days-night-john-2 (Pretty much a rhetorical question, but I'd have loved to have seen John bellow out "Get off my lawn!" I'm sure I'm not the only one. 🙂 )

I'd never heard of this movie. Is it worth a watch?

And I rarely report it, but for this post, kinda fitting I got a 9.


Nop. In that part, the guy you see inside the door that gets the reporter attention, that's supposed to be John. (that's supposed to be or ... oh well whatever. Please grammar nazis be nice with me today) paul-mccartney
 

Yeah, the guy in the blue or green shirt with the gray cap who gets cranky with the younger guy in the orange shirt? That's who I meant. 🙂 Any way to see this movie? It's not on Netflix. Not oin YouTube. And it's really captured my imagination.

"We are all a little weird and life's a little weird, and when we find someone whose weirdness is compatible with ours, we join up with them and fall in mutual weirdness and call it love." — Dr. Seuss

 

 

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mithveaen
Sitarday's room
4618 Posts
(Offline)
14
30 December 2010 - 1.46am

StarWisher said:



Yeah, the guy in the blue or green shirt with the gray cap who gets cranky with the younger guy in the orange shirt? That's who I meant. 🙂 Any way to see this movie? It's not on Netflix. Not oin YouTube. And it's really captured my imagination.
 

No. John Lennon is supposed to be the guy inside the house, not at the door. Watch the trailer and pause at 1.10. There's someone in the background.

 

Mark Staycer is the actor who plays John. This is his look in the movie. Go to the official website, you can buy a digital download through netflix.

 

Image Enlarger

Here comes the sun….. Scoobie-doobie……

Something in the way she moves…..attracts me like a cauliflower…

Bop. Bop, cat bop. Go, Johnny, Go.

Beware of Darkness… 

Avatar
StarWisher
1154 Posts
(Offline)
15
30 December 2010 - 2.04am

Oh! Him! Gotcha! I feel a little sheepish now!

"We are all a little weird and life's a little weird, and when we find someone whose weirdness is compatible with ours, we join up with them and fall in mutual weirdness and call it love." — Dr. Seuss

 

 

Marcelo
478 Posts
(Offline)
16
30 December 2010 - 5.25am

The Walrus said:

Am I the only one annoyed that they chose a McCartney composition for the film title?

 


Yes, that seems to be the case...

I'd like to say "thank you" on behalf of the group and ourselves and I hope we passed the audition.
John Lennon

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mithveaen
Sitarday's room
4618 Posts
(Offline)
17
30 December 2010 - 5.31am

The Walrus said:


Am I the only one annoyed that they chose a McCartney composition for the film title?
 

Naw. He's the Walrus would have been a funnier name. a-hard-days-night-john-2

Here comes the sun….. Scoobie-doobie……

Something in the way she moves…..attracts me like a cauliflower…

Bop. Bop, cat bop. Go, Johnny, Go.

Beware of Darkness… 

Marcelo
478 Posts
(Offline)
18
30 December 2010 - 6.08am

mithveaen said:

The Walrus said:


Am I the only one annoyed that they chose a McCartney composition for the film title?

 


Naw. He's the Walrus would have been a funnier name. a-hard-days-night-john-2
 

That's a good idea! Let me try one too!

Let's see... hmmmm...

 

IMAGINE

 

No, forget it. I'm a moron...

I'd like to say "thank you" on behalf of the group and ourselves and I hope we passed the audition.
John Lennon

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StarWisher
1154 Posts
(Offline)
19
30 December 2010 - 6.17am

Um, Mind Games? (Just Like) Starting Over? When He's 64?

"We are all a little weird and life's a little weird, and when we find someone whose weirdness is compatible with ours, we join up with them and fall in mutual weirdness and call it love." — Dr. Seuss

 

 

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The Walrus
Working for the national health
1024 Posts
(Offline)
20
30 December 2010 - 1.40pm

Just the Two of Us?

And I neeeeeeeeed her all the time

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