Please consider registering
Guest

sp_LogInOut Log In sp_Registration Register

Register | Lost password?
Advanced Search

— Forum Scope —






— Match —





— Forum Options —





Minimum search word length is 3 characters - maximum search word length is 84 characters

sp_Feed sp_Print sp_TopicIcon
Savoy Truffle referencing Ob-La-Di, Ob-La-Da
No permission to create posts
29 November 2012
6.20pm
Avatar
Funny Paper
America
Candlestick Park
Members
Forum Posts: 2080
Member Since:
1 November 2012
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

In the comments section to the song info on "Savoy Truffle" in the Songs section up top (not the forum), someone effused that George's mention of "Ob-La-Di" is the only time any musician has ever referenced another song on the same album.

 

However, Paul did that in his Band On The Run album -- three times!

 

1.  "Helen Wheels", the lyrics reference the song "Band On The Run":  "and Sailor Sam, he came a burning down, but he never will be found"

 

2.  "1985" also references "Band On The Run" by simply breaking into the chorus at the very end then fading out.

 

3.  "Picasso's Last Words" at one point breaks out into a repetition of  "Ho!  Hey Ho!" -- a reference to "Mrs. Vanderbilt".

Faded flowers, wait in a jar, till the evening is complete... complete... complete... complete...

29 November 2012
9.14pm
Avatar
Zig
The Toppermost of the Poppermost
Moderator

Moderators

Members

Reviewers
Forum Posts: 9461
Member Since:
14 April 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Perhaps they meant on a Beatles album? a-hard-days-night-ringo-7

Just guessing.a-hard-days-night-ringo-4

To the fountain of perpetual mirth, Let it roll for all its worth.

MB 931

Every Little Thing you buy from Amazon or iTunes will help the Beatles Bible if you use these links: Amazon | iTunes

29 November 2012
10.08pm
Avatar
meanmistermustard
Moderator
Members

Reviewers


Moderators
Forum Posts: 21263
Member Since:
1 May 2011
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Well John referred to a handful of songs in Glass Onion (eg Fool on the Hill, Fixing A Hole, Lucy In The Sky) on The White Album so there's another one. And if you want to be incredibly anal over it you can hear John refer to Tell Me Why on What Goes On ("i've already told you why") and Ringo calls out "I Feel Fine" when singing Honey Don't on Beatles For Sale which is almost certainly a reference to the song I Feel Fine, there may even be a few others.

 

Just remembered She Loves You and Yesterday are referred to in All You Need Is Love.

The following people thank meanmistermustard for this post:

QuarryMan

"I told you everything I could about me, Told you everything I could" ('Before Believing' - Emmylou Harris) 

"Don't make your love suffer insecurities; Trade the baggage of 'self' to set another one free" ('Paper Skin' - Kendall Payne)

30 November 2012
3.31am
Avatar
Funny Paper
America
Candlestick Park
Members
Forum Posts: 2080
Member Since:
1 November 2012
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

No, the challenge is "any musician" not just the Beatles; and it has to be a reference in one song on an album to another song on the same album.

Faded flowers, wait in a jar, till the evening is complete... complete... complete... complete...

30 November 2012
12.37pm
Avatar
robert
Ed Sullivan Show
Members
Forum Posts: 416
Member Since:
19 April 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

I believe I may be the "effusser" from the Savoy Truffle comment and if so, then my point was really this. Well,

first it's not bringing back a musical theme back from one song into another song, such as the recurrent themes referenced in Band On The Run, or the off-the cuff ad-lib moments on All You Need Is Love ending, or side two of Abbey Road, but George referencing as a part of the official lyric a song on the very same album: "We all know Ob-La-Di, Ob-La-Da" - which of course we didn't really know (at least know well) because you'd only heard it once as you listened through the LP the first time.

And yes John does make those references to other Beatle tunes in Glass Onion - but they are not songs from the very same album.

 

And finally, my real point was that the Beatles were now acknowledging their own cultural iconic status (IMHO) by being able to reference their own work in such a matter of fact manner.

 

Clear as mud?

The following people thank robert for this post:

vonbontee

"She looks more like him than I do."

30 November 2012
12.51pm
Avatar
BluemeanAl
North Carolina, USA
London Palladium
Members
Forum Posts: 163
Member Since:
20 January 2012
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

I'm not coming up with many such in-album self-references, but the Who did make the "Reign O'er Me" reference at least a couple of times through Quadrophenia.  As this was a "rock opera," I guess that "Reign" was a recurring theme and therefore may not officially count here. 

And of course, the Beatles dropped that second bit of "You Never Give Me Your Money" into "Carry That Weight."

Both of which are decidedly different from George's lyrical reference.

It's gotta be rock and roll music if you wanna dance with me

30 November 2012
3.34pm
Avatar
meanmistermustard
Moderator
Members

Reviewers


Moderators
Forum Posts: 21263
Member Since:
1 May 2011
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Well i get a big fat F grade for not answering the actual question. Need to read the paper properly next time.

 

I have a feeling that Queen may have made references to other songs on the same lp however i cant think which songs or albums off the top of my head. More of that Jazz on their '78 Jazz album has actual parts of the other songs on the album towards the end but thats not whats really the same thing.

Wait Bicycle Race ("Fat bottomed girls they'll be riding today") and to a different aspect Fat Bottomed Girls ("Get on your bikes and ride") (its not a direct title but its an obvious reference as they were a double a-side single) both reference each other and both are on Jazz.  Maybe thats still in keeping with the Band On The Run thing.

 

Unless you are looking a for a band/artist who says "we told you about song x 5 minutes ago" or words to that effect.

 

And heading back to Band On The Run Picasso's Last Words also heads back to Jet. That album has quite a few tracks that nod to other tracks on the album.

"I told you everything I could about me, Told you everything I could" ('Before Believing' - Emmylou Harris) 

"Don't make your love suffer insecurities; Trade the baggage of 'self' to set another one free" ('Paper Skin' - Kendall Payne)

1 December 2012
6.50am
Avatar
Funny Paper
America
Candlestick Park
Members
Forum Posts: 2080
Member Since:
1 November 2012
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

robert said
I believe I may be the "effusser" from the Savoy Truffle comment and if so, then my point was really this. Well,

first it's not bringing back a musical theme back from one song into another song, such as the recurrent themes referenced in Band On The Run, or the off-the cuff ad-lib moments on All You Need Is Love ending, or side two of Abbey Road, but George referencing as a part of the official lyric a song on the very same album: "We all know Ob-La-Di, Ob-La-Da" - which of course we didn't really know (at least know well) because you'd only heard it once as you listened through the LP the first time.

And yes John does make those references to other Beatle tunes in Glass Onion - but they are not songs from the very same album.

 

And finally, my real point was that the Beatles were now acknowledging their own cultural iconic status (IMHO) by being able to reference their own work in such a matter of fact manner.

 

Clear as mud?

Thanks robert, your argument makes sense, though it seems rather narrow in its parameters.  Also, you are kind of depending on your interpretation of the meaning of George's lyric to be correct -- perhaps Paul helped George at that juncture in the song and said "Laddie, why not just throw in 'Ob La Di' at this point?"   That line seems the weakest in the whole song, and perhaps George had run out of clever desserts at that point...

Faded flowers, wait in a jar, till the evening is complete... complete... complete... complete...

1 December 2012
1.43pm
Ben Ramon
Carnegie Hall
Members
Forum Posts: 612
Member Since:
26 March 2012
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Paul had the band run through Ob-La-Di to the point of sickness, right? In light of that, it seems pretty clear to me that George was taking a minor swipe at the tribulations of practicing such a chocolatey song so many times- "what is sweet now, turns so sour."

And to come to Funny Paper's original challenge, there must be countless albums which reference the same song: any album with any kind of reprise or recurring musical or lyrical theme would be doing so. If you knew where to look, you could list hundreds. Although the instance in Savoy Truffle is slightly random and anachronistic, it wouldn't seem to be anything groundbreaking.

One striking instance I can think of is Marvin Gaye's 1971 record What's Going On, where the title track is repeated as a kind of socially-motivated denouement at the end of "Inner City Blues."

SHUT UP - Paulie's talkin'

1 December 2012
8.31pm
Avatar
IMDeWalrus
Terrace BC Canada
Abbey Road
Members
Forum Posts: 97
Member Since:
26 July 2011
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Yeah, I've always figured George was venting a little frustration over having to do and re-do "ObLaDi, ObLaDa" over and over again with that line... then again, it may have simply been a placeholder line (kind of like "attracts me like a cauliflower" in "Something") which George decided he liked and kept in the final recording.   I don't know that George ever commented about it himself.

I've got nothing to say, but it's okay..

GOOD MORNING!

GOOD MORNING!!

GOOD MORNING!!!

1 December 2012
9.09pm
Avatar
meanmistermustard
Moderator
Members

Reviewers


Moderators
Forum Posts: 21263
Member Since:
1 May 2011
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

I think that line has been discussed here before, not that i know which thread. Personally ive always thought it was a dig at how many hours they spent recording it, a sardonic comment.

"I told you everything I could about me, Told you everything I could" ('Before Believing' - Emmylou Harris) 

"Don't make your love suffer insecurities; Trade the baggage of 'self' to set another one free" ('Paper Skin' - Kendall Payne)

8 December 2012
5.17pm
Avatar
...ontherun
Massachusetts
London Palladium
Members
Forum Posts: 187
Member Since:
3 March 2012
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Funny Paper said

No, the challenge is "any musician" not just the Beatles; and it has to be a reference in one song on an album to another song on the same album.

"Tommy" anyone?

A square is not a square when the sides are less than four...

9 December 2012
12.19am
Avatar
Funny Paper
America
Candlestick Park
Members
Forum Posts: 2080
Member Since:
1 November 2012
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

...ontherun said

Funny Paper said

No, the challenge is "any musician" not just the Beatles; and it has to be a reference in one song on an album to another song on the same album.

"Tommy" anyone?

 

Well, being in the genre of a "rock opera" it would be strange for the different songs NOT to reference each other.

Faded flowers, wait in a jar, till the evening is complete... complete... complete... complete...

16 November 2017
8.16pm
Avatar
vonbontee
Inside an Apple Orchard in a Letterbox
Rishikesh
Members
Forum Posts: 3335
Member Since:
1 December 2009
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Funny Paper said
No, the challenge is "any musician" not just the Beatles; and it has to be a reference in one song on an album to another song on the same album.  

The main example I can think of is Can, from their 1971 double album "Tago Mago". "Halleluwah" covers all of Side 2 and features the lyric "I was singing
Mushroom head, Oh yeah, Paperhouse", which are the titles of all three tracks on the previous side. I know there are other examples, but I can't think of any offhand that aren't off concept-type albums, such as those already cited by the Who and Paul McC. 

(Beatles example that could've been: The full length version of "Dig It", in which John just reads "Get Back" and all the other rehearsed song titles from a possible set list.)

The following people thank vonbontee for this post:

Pineapple Records

I remember George saying 'Blimey, he's always talking about “Yesterday”, you'd think he was Beethoven or somebody' - Paul McCartney

17 November 2017
1.12am
Avatar
Billy Rhythm
Carnegie Hall
Members
Forum Posts: 649
Member Since:
22 December 2013
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

meanmistermustard said
Well i get a big fat F grade for not answering the actual question

Not at all...  In fact, your example of 'Honey Don't' referencing 'I Feel Fine' applies for they are both on the 'Beatles '65' album...:-)

IMDeWalrus said
I've always figured George was venting a little frustration over having to do and re-do "ObLaDi, ObLaDa" over and over again with that line...

Paul was a favourite target of George's frustration creatively 'round this time...  A more graphic example would be 'Not Guilty' which is why, I felt, that it was left off of the 'White Album'...  It certainly wasn't for lack of musical inventiveness...  with the 'Savoy Truffle' quip, he was able to slip one in there...  possibly without Paul even realizing it at the time...  the song's lyrics were built around Eric Clapton's sweet tooth after all...  'Not Guilty', on the other hand, appears to center around his attitude towards Paul McCartney in 1968:

 

Not guilty
For getting in your way
While you're trying to steal the day
Not guilty
And I'm not here for the rest 
I'm not trying to steal your vest

I am not trying to be smart 
I only want what I can get 
I'm really sorry for your ageing head 
But like you heard me said 
Not guilty

No use handing me a writ
While I'm trying to do my bit

I don't expect to take your heart
I only want what I can get 
I'm really sorry that you're underfed
But like you heard me said
Not guilty

Not guilty
For looking like a freak 
Making friends with every Sikh 
Not guilty
For leading you astray
On the road to Mandalay

I won't upset the apple cart 
I only want what I can get 
I'm really sorry that you've been misled
But like you heard me said 
Not guilty

 

The 'Ob-La-Di, Ob-La-Da' reference almost seems tame by comparison...  George doesn't get enough credit for his lyrics...  outstanding...  and such stark contrast to 'The Inner Light' released earlier in 1968...:-)

The following people thank Billy Rhythm for this post:

vonbontee
17 November 2017
1.51pm
Avatar
Silly Girl
Find me where ye echo lays
Apple rooftop
Members
Forum Posts: 11024
Member Since:
15 February 2015
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

When I first saw this thread come up, I thought it was titled 'Savoy Truffle renouncing Ob-La-Di, Ob-La-Da'. Which is also somewhat accurate.

The following people thank Silly Girl for this post:

Ahhh Girl, Pineapple Records
Cloudless every day you fall upon my waking eyes, inviting and inciting me to rise

 Silly-Girl-2016.png
smirkHummm Wot ye lookin at? New to Forumpool? You can introduce yourself here*_*Eh wotMmm

18 November 2017
6.47am
Avatar
QuarryMan
Carnegie Hall
Members
Forum Posts: 630
Member Since:
26 January 2017
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

What about Here Comes The Sun and Sun King

The following people thank QuarryMan for this post:

sir walter raleigh

"we're not arrogant, we just believe we're the best band in the world"

- Noel Gallagher

"You are tearing me apart Lisa"

- Tommy Wiseau

Forum Timezone: America/Chicago

Most Users Ever Online: 597

Currently Online: Little Piggy Dragonguy, ewe2, The Hole Got Fixed
125 Guest(s)

Currently Browsing this Page:
1 Guest(s)

Top Posters:

Starr Shine?: 14975

Silly Girl: 11015

Necko: 7444

Ron Nasty: 7384

parlance: 7097

mr. Sun king coming together: 6411

Mr. Kite: 6144

trcanberra: 6000

AppleScruffJunior: 5177

mithveaen: 4613

Member Stats:

Guest Posters: 87

Members: 2461

Moderators: 4

Admins: 2

Forum Stats:

Groups: 3

Forums: 42

Topics: 4411

Posts: 274707

Newest Members:

Jon, subor322, john snow, NowhereBhoy, Kirbygene

Moderators: Ahhh Girl: 15301, meanmistermustard: 21255, Zig: 9454, Joe: 4834

Administrators: Joe: 4834, Ellie: 4

Members Birthdays
sp_BirthdayIcon
Today: IveJustSeenAFaceo
Upcoming: yourmothershouldknow, chrisredditch, Georgous, fourcoolbeatles, Evangeline, Angela