Please consider registering
Guest
sp_LogInOut Log In sp_Registration Register
Register | Lost password?
Advanced Search
Forum Scope


Match



Forum Options



Minimum search word length is 3 characters - maximum search word length is 84 characters
sp_Feed sp_TopicIcon
This settles the Ringo vs. Pete debate once and for all
29 October 2014
2.00pm
Avatar
Matt Busby
In the town where I was born
Shea Stadium
Members
Forum Posts: 932
Member Since:
7 February 2014
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

To get back to the original premise (a year+ later)...

What made me realize, once and for all, that Ringo was "right" for the Beatles and Pete was not, was when I tried to imagine Pete on In My Life .  To my ears, Ringo plays a big part in making that song as good as it is, and Pete just didn't have the finesse to do it.

Half of what I say is meaningless...

I feel good in a special way, I'm in love and it's a sunny day

BeatlesBible.com earns royalties if you use these links when shopping: Amazon | iTunes

29 October 2014
9.18pm
Avatar
MOCKSWELL
Canaduh
The Kaiserkeller
Members
Forum Posts: 54
Member Since:
8 October 2014
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Hiya Pete! Gee he looks good, probably still plays good, and hasn't been assaulted by pzychoFans. Nice job, ex-Beatle is.

Ringo was drafted because he was perfect, he looked perfect. Neither he nor Pete were refined drummers in 1961... they were rockers. Mr. Purdy proves that... but whatever, I don't think there's much nevermind betwixt Pete and Ringo. The word is 'charisma' and once Ringo plugged in the job was done.

 People sometimes forget how crazy famous the Beatles became. You had to be there to appreciate it, it was new ground. So, the powers-that-be saw Ringo clip in and the flashbulbs went off - they now looked perfect. Like the 3 Stooges or the Marx Bros. or something - totally marketable and loveable.

That's why Ringo got the gig, primarily. In retrospect Pete is probably aware he's better off with his health and mind largely intact. I hope he's still jamming around and having a good time. If he plays here I will go and fling jellybabies at him. )

29 October 2014
9.23pm
Avatar
AppleScruffJunior
Sitting here doing nothing but procrastinating...
Apple rooftop
Reviewers

Members
Forum Posts: 7209
Member Since:
18 March 2013
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Oh Christ that is too funny! I can barely type- those fills though ahdn_george_08

 Jesus poor Pete a-hard-days-night-paul-7

The following people thank AppleScruffJunior for this post:

parlance

 

INTROVERTS UNITE! Separately....in your own homes!

                 ***

Make Love, Not Wardrobes!

                ***

"Stop throwing jelly beans at me"- George Harrison

30 October 2014
12.37am
Avatar
Billy Rhythm
Shea Stadium
Members
Forum Posts: 953
Member Since:
22 December 2013
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

The "Ringo vs. Pete debate" lasted all but a few days once word got out around Liverpool about the change in lineup back in 1962, since then it was never really in question whether they made the right move or not, why it's being brought up here in late 2014 is most puzzling to me, Ringo Forever Pete Never...:-)

The following people thank Billy Rhythm for this post:

Mr. Kite
30 October 2014
8.50pm
Avatar
MOCKSWELL
Canaduh
The Kaiserkeller
Members
Forum Posts: 54
Member Since:
8 October 2014
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

 Personally I'd rather start a band with Pete than Ringo, to avoid the screaming and huge crowds. But then he is probably even older than me. Yea, yea, yup.

31 October 2014
5.25pm
Avatar
Hey Jude !
BeatlesBible House, Nowhere Land
Ed Sullivan Show
Members
Forum Posts: 494
Member Since:
2 June 2014
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

I will try not to listen so i don't ruin the original songs but It's So Hard to resist. Oh noooo im already listening to come together. a-hard-days-night-ringo-6Save meeeeee, I need help nowa-hard-days-night-ringo-14a-hard-days-night-ringo-13

19 February 2015
10.05pm
BeatPest
Casbah Coffee Club
Members
Forum Posts: 18
Member Since:
29 November 2014
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

mccartneyalarm said  Also...why didn't they ask Pete Best to fill in for Ringo on the Australia tour when Ringo was sick and Jimmy Nicol took over for Ringo for three weeks? Just wonderin'

Are you serious, how can you ask ? Maybe because after trying to get rid of him for 2 years and replace him by Ringo whom they felt was a better drummer it would not have look very logical to ask him back to sub for Ringo if they thought he was a lesser drummer  than  him, don't you think ? Besides they fired him but they didn't have the guts to do it themselves and didn't speak to him everafter so I don't think it was on the agenda of any of them at any time. And it's a blessing for Pete he didn't do it, it was for 5 concerts only, not the whole tour. After that they would have sacked him again to make way for Ringo so thanks God he didn't have to live through that a second time. It would have been hell to him and to them. Jimmie Nicol who was a better drummer than Ringo lives the Beatlemania dream for 2 weeks and never recovered from it. His career and even his life were forever  destroyed. Pete Best did well.

The following people thank BeatPest for this post:

Oudis
19 February 2015
10.36pm
BeatPest
Casbah Coffee Club
Members
Forum Posts: 18
Member Since:
29 November 2014
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

meanmistermustard said
I don't know SH, I think im too far gone at just being pissed off at him building up his part.

Out of interest did John, Paul and George ask others before Pete? I don't ask with an evil intent, im just genuinely interested to know if they put the feelers out to see who was available or head-hunted Mr Best immediately?

 

Yes Tommy Moore was 10 years older. His wife made him choose between the drums and the factory. He chose the factory. Norman Chapman fit the part well but he was one the last boy in the UK in the 60s who had to go to National Service. They had to "borrow" Dave Lovelady from Kingsize Taylor & the Dominoes or Johnny Hutchinson from the Big Three (also managed by Brian Epstein he deputised for a late Tommy Moore when they auditionned for Larry Parnes and he's the one who played drums on the few shows between Pete & Ringo in August 62. He hated the Beatles and refused to be interviewed by Mark Lewisohn). There's also the mysterious drummer who answered the ad the Beatles put in the music papers before they went to Hamburg but in 1960 no computer so the answer came too late so Pete was already on the trip. But if ... who knows if Ringo would have been in the Beatles ? And if John had accepted Klaus Voormann proposition to be the bass player after Stu had quit the band the Beatles would have become the Fab Five ? Another player who's forgotten is Chas Newby who played 4 shows as the Beatles bass player in December 60 between 2 Hamburg trips when Stu stayed with Astrid in Germany for Christmas.

20 February 2015
5.58am
Avatar
Oudis
Candlestick Park
Members
Forum Posts: 1491
Member Since:
15 May 2014
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

BeatPest said

mccartneyalarm said  Also...why didn't they ask Pete Best to fill in for Ringo on the Australia tour when Ringo was sick and Jimmy Nicol took over for Ringo for three weeks? Just wonderin'

Are you serious, how can you ask ? Maybe because after trying to get rid of him for 2 years and replace him by Ringo whom they felt was a better drummer it would not have look very logical to ask him back to sub for Ringo if they thought he was a lesser drummer  than  him, don't you think ? Besides they fired him but they didn't have the guts to do it themselves and didn't speak to him everafter so I don't think it was on the agenda of any of them at any time. And it's a blessing for Pete he didn't do it, it was for 5 concerts only, not the whole tour. After that they would have sacked him again to make way for Ringo so thanks God he didn't have to live through that a second time. It would have been hell to him and to them. Jimmie Nicol who was a better drummer than Ringo lives the Beatlemania dream for 2 weeks and never recovered from it. His career and even his life were forever  destroyed. Pete Best did well.

Could you tell us about that, @BeatPest? I'd really like to know.

Forsan et haec olim meminisse juvabit” (“Perhaps one day it will be a pleasure to look back on even this”; Virgil, The Aeneid, Book 1, line 203, where Aeneas says this to his men after the shipwreck that put them on the shores of Africa)

20 February 2015
1.41pm
Avatar
Ahhh Girl
sailing on a winedark open sea
Moderator

Moderators

Members

Reviewers
Forum Posts: 19312
Member Since:
20 August 2013
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Joe has some interesting facts on his Jimmie Nicol page. https://www.beatlesbible.com/p.....mie-nicol/

The following people thank Ahhh Girl for this post:

Oudis
20 February 2015
10.20pm
Avatar
Oudis
Candlestick Park
Members
Forum Posts: 1491
Member Since:
15 May 2014
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

I've just seen the first posts of this thread and listened to the clips. I don’t know who is responsible for them, but all those “versions” of Beatles’ classics with Pete’s drumming on them are really mean-spirited, vile, and despicable. We don’t know what kind of drummer he would have evolved into in due time, by the time of “A Day In The Life ” or “Come Together ”. Ringo himself evolved –gee, the four of them did– as a musician. Having said that I’ll repeat for the ninth time that no, I’ve got nothing against Ringo, that yes, I do like his style. But having fun at an episode that probably caused Mr. Best a lot of sorrow is plain evil.

The following people thank Oudis for this post:

Von Bontee

Forsan et haec olim meminisse juvabit” (“Perhaps one day it will be a pleasure to look back on even this”; Virgil, The Aeneid, Book 1, line 203, where Aeneas says this to his men after the shipwreck that put them on the shores of Africa)

20 February 2015
10.44pm
Avatar
Bongo
Somewhere In Time
Candlestick Park
Members
Forum Posts: 1725
Member Since:
28 March 2014
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

DrBeatle said
HAHAHAHAHAHA this is fucking hilarious! Don't watch/listen to this if you're somewhere you can't bust out howling with laughter (I made this mistake at work just now!) :lol:
For everyone who thinks "was Pete Best really that bad a drummer?"

 pete-bestThat was funny. Mean, but funny! brian-epstein

http://i276.photobucket.com/albums/kk38/rickdelsie/The%20Beatles/parlunread_zps28270d9d.gif BEATLES Music gives me Eargasms!  apple01

21 February 2015
1.11pm
BeatPest
Casbah Coffee Club
Members
Forum Posts: 18
Member Since:
29 November 2014
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

meanmistermustard said
I would have a lot more respect for Pete if he just said he was a good drummer who got dropped at the worst moment and didn't turn up on every 2 bit show repeating the same 30 second oversell (has he said anything new in the last 20 years?). I now turn off whenever I see him.

 

To begin with I suppose Pete himself could have lost any respect he had for John, Paul & George when they asked Brian to fire him instead of doing it themselves. When you think they asked Nigel Whalley to do the same with Eric Griffiths at the time of the Quarrymen, looks like when it comes to human relationships there's some things these guys were never able to learn to do properly. And to think none of them find it necessary to speak to him, even once, since 62 ! All you need  is love and Give Peace A Chance indeed !

21 February 2015
1.34pm
BeatPest
Casbah Coffee Club
Members
Forum Posts: 18
Member Since:
29 November 2014
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
vonbontee said
 
 

 (And still Pete has to suffer the minor indignity of having his head edited out of the cover collage - now that's just ridiculously petty and blatant and silly! Just like Gandhi not making the SPLHCB cut - as if it's gonna offend somebody, for chrissakes. Couldn't they find some little blurry live photo in which his face was naturally indistinct? - it'd have been less obvious, more subtle. Really, this kind of thing just makes me do a facepalm - silly little ego-move along the lines of "McCartney-Lennon". Unless maybe they intended the blatant obviousness of it to be a kind of nasty-funny minor form of revenge? That's worth a chuckle or two, if so.)

 

Absolutely. What is really sad is it's deliberate because the artwork is made by Klaus Voormann who knew exactly what he was doing because he was there at the time. He knew Pete belonged to that picture. I'm not surprised to see Paul & George (or Ringo for that matter) had no concern for Pete's feelings but I didn't think Klaus would join them. I just hope that if John was sill there he wouldn't approved it since it was done in such an unsubtle manner. How far can you go in being ridiculous  and arrogant when you try to rewrite history ? What's next ? Paste Ringo's face on Pete's for the next edtion ? Erase  Pete's drum parts and have Ringo re-recorded them ? Pete had the last word for his 2008 album "Haymans Green". He put the missing part of the picture on the cover. Nice touch, good record. Being a bad drummer for the Beatles doesn't mean you're doing bad music with another band.

The following people thank BeatPest for this post:

Oudis
21 February 2015
5.54pm
Avatar
Von Bontee
A Hole In The Road
Rishikesh
Members
Forum Posts: 4423
Member Since:
14 December 2009
sp_UserOnlineSmall Online

Haha @BeatPest , without my glasses I misread your username as "beatpete" and got really excited for a sec, wondering if you were the man himself!

That is depressing, Klaus' complicity in the whole thing. But yeah, good on Pete for that re-paste job. Didn't even know he had an album in '08...I kinda want to see a documentary on this guy's life now. (This is all news to me, thanks.)

One day, a tape-op got a tape on backwards, he went to play it, and it was all "Neeeradno-undowarrroom" and it was "Wow! Sounds Indian!"
-- Paul McCartney

                 Winner-Funniest-Post-and-Most-Creative-Contribution-2017-1.pngfunniest-post-badge2018.png

21 February 2015
7.16pm
Avatar
meanmistermustard
Here when I am. Not when I am not.
Moderator
Members

Reviewers


Moderators
Forum Posts: 23228
Member Since:
1 May 2011
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Not sure why any of the Beatles should have spoken to Pete after he got sacked. What do you say in that situation anyway - "hi, sorry we got you sacked, didnt tell you to your face and then became huge without you. No hard feelings. Want to go for a coffee before we go back in the studio. Is it ok if Ringo tags along?". 

Their paths did cross at least twice after the sacking and not too soon afterward he got the boot.

The Anthology cover could very easily have been a way of reflecting that Pete being replaced with Ringo was not done in a professional manner as its so noticeable. Maybe not.

"I told you everything I could about me, Told you everything I could" ('Before Believing' - Emmylou Harris)

22 February 2015
3.19am
Avatar
4or5Magicians
The Foothills of the Headlands
London Palladium
Members
Forum Posts: 184
Member Since:
18 January 2014
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Haha those were great. Lackluster yet intrusive is a perfect description! I just kept listening to each one knowing how terrible it was going to be. Totally worth it, even if it is kind of mean spirited.

 

As for Pete sounding bitter in interviews, let's put it in context. Imagine how annoying it must be to be Paul sometimes (for example). No matter where he goes or what he does, people are going to bring up the Beatles at some point. Let's face it- as much amazing work that Paul has done since they broke up, you know he's at least occasionally getting booked for interviews, etc, based on his work as a Beatle no matter what he's currently doing (this is definitely the case for Pete). As annoying as that seems like it would be to get the same old questions and comments about something that happened close to half a century ago... imagine having to go through all that without the fame and money that goes along with it. I know I'd probably come off as bitter. pete-best

^ Even his smiley looks kind of bitter. (You mad, bro?) a-hard-days-night-ringo-8

 

Granted I haven't seen too many of his interviews, but I've seen a few. The subtext seems to always go something along the lines of "So Pete... you missed out on being in the most popular band ever. All of the crazy parties, getting high with Dylan, meeting Elvis. Not to mention an unlimited supply of groupies while traveling the world. That's gotta suck, amirite?" Not even Fonzie could act cool considering the circumstances. A slightly less popular band? Sure. Interviewers might just be like "oh, that's cool. You were the drummer for Simon and Garfunkel for a while" as opposed to "Oh man that sucks! You must be kicking yourself over that one!"

 

At times, though it seems like he can laugh at the situation. Like him wearing that shirt that says "I'm not Ringo" or something. If you're going to live the rest of your life as "that guy that got sacked for Ringo", might as well accept it and laugh sometimes.

 

That said, I'm glad we got Ringo. Ringo's awesome.

22 February 2015
12.03pm
Avatar
meanmistermustard
Here when I am. Not when I am not.
Moderator
Members

Reviewers


Moderators
Forum Posts: 23228
Member Since:
1 May 2011
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Its not as if Pete has got much else folk are going to be interested in when he goes on talk shows, it will be the main reason he has been booked in the first place. For Paul and Ringo they usually go on to discuss their latest album/tour/whatever else they are plugging, tho they have to accept The Beatles are going to come up at some point. 

The following people thank meanmistermustard for this post:

Zig

"I told you everything I could about me, Told you everything I could" ('Before Believing' - Emmylou Harris)

26 February 2015
4.42am
Avatar
Oudis
Candlestick Park
Members
Forum Posts: 1491
Member Since:
15 May 2014
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

BeatPest said 

 Jimmie Nicol who was a better drummer than Ringo lives the Beatlemania dream for 2 weeks and never recovered from it. His career and even his life were forever  destroyed. 

Ahhh Girl said
Joe has some interesting facts on his Jimmie Nicol page. https://www.beatlesbible.com/p.....mie-nicol/

I’ve read the Jimmie Nicol page. Jimmie Nicol, Peter Best –sad stories.

Forsan et haec olim meminisse juvabit” (“Perhaps one day it will be a pleasure to look back on even this”; Virgil, The Aeneid, Book 1, line 203, where Aeneas says this to his men after the shipwreck that put them on the shores of Africa)

6 May 2018
11.31am
Avatar
Billy Rhythm
Shea Stadium
Members
Forum Posts: 953
Member Since:
22 December 2013
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

John pretty much "settles the Ringo vs. Pete debate once and for all" here:

 

 

I think that too much has been made of the "cowardly" act of having their Manager deliver the bad news...  People tend to forget that The Beatles also had Brian Epstein call up Ringo to offer him the job as well...  They were about focusing on the music and their decision was based solely on that, they had a Manager to take care of the details...  They likely never informed George Martin personally that they were "replacing" him with another producer for the 'Let It Be ' album either...  Business is Business...  It's no small wonder that their fortunes changed dramatically the moment that Ringo arrived, he was the missing ingredient and there could be no looking back...:-)

The following people thank Billy Rhythm for this post:

sir walter raleigh
Forum Timezone: America/Chicago
Most Users Ever Online: 700
Currently Online: Von Bontee, sir walter raleigh, alittlebitolder
Guest(s) 1
Currently Browsing this Page:
1 Guest(s)
Top Posters:
Starr Shine?: 15889
Ron Nasty: 10730
50yearslate: 8585
Necko: 7898
AppleScruffJunior: 7209
parlance: 7111
mr. Sun king coming together: 6403
Mr. Kite: 6147
trcanberra: 6064
sir walter raleigh: 5062
Member Stats:
Guest Posters: 87
Members: 2554
Moderators: 6
Admins: 1
Forum Stats:
Groups: 3
Forums: 44
Topics: 4877
Posts: 348564
Newest Members:
TSITSINIS7, mincerray, HarrisonsBird, FelicityMcG92, Arthur Sultan
Moderators: Joe: 5096, Zig: 9812, meanmistermustard: 23228, Ahhh Girl: 19312, Beatlebug: 17215, The Hole Got Fixed: 7879
Administrators: Joe: 5096