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4.31pm
1 November 2012
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This topic is, in a way, more about the annoying fact I often experience, where some Beatles fans describe some detail about a Beatles song, then I listen carefully to that song and I CAN’T HEAR IT!!!
Example: From an old discussion in the Songs section (not in the Forum here) about “I Wanna Hold Your Hand” —
Why did they sometimes say “sh” instead of a clean “s” sound? Was it just more rock and roll or was it just joking around?
Joe Friday 7 May 2010
Deadman Saturday 8 May 2010Saying “sh” instead of “s” avoids excessive sibilance, particularly when using a close microphone. These days, of course. you can just turn on a “de-esser” effect.
‘As I listened to the playbacks of “Misery ” that afternoon, I was also struck by the way John and Paul sang the word “send” as “shend”…. Changing an “s” to an [sic] “sh” was an affectation on some American records…
[End Quote]
I just listened to the song twice. I can’t hear any “SH” sounds. A couple of times, there is a very subtle pronunciation of the S that borders, perhaps, on an SH sound, but nothing clearly so. And most of the time — THEY ARE UNMISTAKABLY SINGING THE S SOUND!!! Or am I in the freaking Twilight Zone?
Sorry for twisting and shouting, but man, this annoys me!
Faded flowers, wait in a jar, till the evening is complete... complete... complete... complete...
4.34pm
1 November 2012
Offline Also, a P.S. — concerning that “SH” affectation alluded to by the commenters quoted above, I would observe that indisputably, Cher was (and remains) the World Champion of that affectation.
Faded flowers, wait in a jar, till the evening is complete... complete... complete... complete...
7.13pm
19 April 2010
Offline In “I Want To Hold Your Hand ” the SH sound is added to the word “understand” as in “I think you’ll undershtand” – I remember reading either Paul or John saying they did it on purpose in a few songs (Misery being the most obvious) because they sought it sounded cool and different. My friends and I picked up on it right away and always laughed when we’d sing those spots.
"She looks more like him than I do."
12.12am
3 March 2012
Offline The de-esser thing sounds right. Bono does it a lot when singing live. Where the SHtreets have no nammmeeeee…..
A square is not a square when the sides are less than four...
6.47pm
1 November 2012
Offline The S in “understand” is slightly SH-ish, but not as marked as other singers have done it, to my ears.
The de-esser theory doesn’t seem logical: why would they leave so many other esses intact throughout the song, if they were worried about that sibillation? Doesn’t make sense they would only pick one word to be worried about.
I think the slight SH sound is all Paul’s affectation, by the way.
In addition, I have noticed that the SH sound is a black thing, and has influenced many whites. I don’t know how long this influence has been going on, and if it was going on in the 50s-60s context by which to influence Paul when he was listening to those Little Richard songs etc.
Faded flowers, wait in a jar, till the evening is complete... complete... complete... complete...
7.10pm
1 November 2012
Offline An example of extreme sibillation is how John Lennon sharply enunciates the esses in “666” in his song “Nutopia” (from the Mind Games album):
We understand your paranoia
but we don’t wanna play your game
You think you’re cool and know what you are doing
SIX SIX SIX is your name…
Faded flowers, wait in a jar, till the evening is complete... complete... complete... complete...
6.46pm
1 November 2012
Offline Incidentally, it’s interesting if not ironic that in the German version of the song (Komm, Gib Mir Deine Hand ), the line translating the “understand” part has the German approximate Verstand —
Du nimmst mir den Verstand
— and with Verstand, to be accurate, you really DO want to emphasize the SH sound!
Faded flowers, wait in a jar, till the evening is complete... complete... complete... complete...
9.44pm
21 November 2012
Offline Never heard that SH sound either, but I’m really bad with those things. I found this anomalies website, and when you know what’s there, most of them are really obvious and you hear them right away, but if I don’t..well then I don’t hear it, like now.
Will pay attention to it next time I listen to it, now I’m curious. So it’s during the ”I’ll think you understand” part?
2.52am
1 November 2012
Offline Linde said
Will pay attention to it next time I listen to it, now I’m curious. So it’s during the ”I’ll think you understand” part?
I only hear it very slightly. But in the German version it’s more pronounced (as it should be).
Faded flowers, wait in a jar, till the evening is complete... complete... complete... complete...
7.18pm
1 December 2009
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I’ve never heard it either, but I just figure its my own ears, or the way my stereo’s set up, or something equally subjective. Enough people on that Songs page have commented on it to make it a “thing”. (shrugs) I don’t think there’s necessarily anything “Twilight Zone” about it – it’s not like people are commenting about an entire phantom lyric or guitar part that somebody claims exists or doesn’t exist.
GEORGE: In fact, The Detroit Sound. JOHN: In fact, yes. GEORGE: In fact, yeah. Tamla-Motown artists are our favorites. The Miracles. JOHN: We like Marvin Gaye. GEORGE: The Impressions PAUL & GEORGE: Mary Wells. GEORGE: The Exciters. RINGO: Chuck Jackson. JOHN: To name but eighty.
7.27pm
18 November 2011
Offline It’s on a bunch of the early songs. I believe Geoff Emerick mentions it in his book.
“Well she was just, sheventeen…”
It’s there but it’s very subtle. They don’t do it on every “S” either.
8.26pm
1 December 2009
Offline I guess there’s no definitive answer – there’s a bit of a grey area where “s” begins and “sh” leaves off. No two people have the identical interior landscapes in their mouths.
GEORGE: In fact, The Detroit Sound. JOHN: In fact, yes. GEORGE: In fact, yeah. Tamla-Motown artists are our favorites. The Miracles. JOHN: We like Marvin Gaye. GEORGE: The Impressions PAUL & GEORGE: Mary Wells. GEORGE: The Exciters. RINGO: Chuck Jackson. JOHN: To name but eighty.
10.59pm
21 November 2012
Offline Okay I’ve listened to it again and I clearly heard it this time. That’s funny.
There’s also this bit where one of them goes ”I wanna hold your hand” and the other one sings ”I’d like to hold your hand” (or something like that..anyway, it’s not ”wanna’'
That always annoys me, it’s a bit sloppy.
11.32pm
1 December 2009
Offline Yeah haha, John forgets what verse it is and starts to sing “You’ll let me hold your hand” or something! Just like him to mess up a lyric! I actually like that, that they kept it in.
GEORGE: In fact, The Detroit Sound. JOHN: In fact, yes. GEORGE: In fact, yeah. Tamla-Motown artists are our favorites. The Miracles. JOHN: We like Marvin Gaye. GEORGE: The Impressions PAUL & GEORGE: Mary Wells. GEORGE: The Exciters. RINGO: Chuck Jackson. JOHN: To name but eighty.
1.01am
6 December 2012
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Those kind of mistakes happen in some of their other songs, too. But I can’t think of any right now… curse my forgetful brain.
Also known as Egg-Rock, Egg-Roll, E-George, Eggy, Ravioli, Eggroll Eggrolli...
~witty quote~
4.27am
18 November 2011
Offline I believe that “I’ll Get You ” has a few of those mistakes. They’re much more common in the ’63 and early ’64 songs.
7.33pm
1 December 2009
Offline Yeah, those earlier songs had more instances of John & Paul singing in unison, so it makes sense that you’d find more examples. Also I presume they were more rushed in the studio, less committed to “perfection” in those more innocent days.
GEORGE: In fact, The Detroit Sound. JOHN: In fact, yes. GEORGE: In fact, yeah. Tamla-Motown artists are our favorites. The Miracles. JOHN: We like Marvin Gaye. GEORGE: The Impressions PAUL & GEORGE: Mary Wells. GEORGE: The Exciters. RINGO: Chuck Jackson. JOHN: To name but eighty.
11.10pm
15 June 2011
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In I Want To Hold Your Hand , around 1:20, you can hear them sing “when I shay that somethings”.
Sont des mots qui vont très bien ensemble.
3.57pm
12 December 2019
Offline4.07pm
5 December 2019
Offline I talked about this in the Taste of Honey thread, but yeah they used it for de-essing and to also sound more like their American idols. Geoff Emerick talks about it for a short paragraph in his book.
"....When I cannot sing my heart, I can only speak my mind...."
"....This ain't no party, this ain't no disco, this ain't no fooling around...."
||She/They ||
