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Could the Mods come to a common position please...
17 July 2016
9.39am
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Ron Nasty
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I was criticised in another thread for posting a possible problem with that thread, with the post suggesting I was ignoring mod requests to report such concerns by PM to the mods. This was stated as if it was agreed position between Joe and all the mods.

Yet this is at odds with the existence of the "Mother Superior Jumped the Gun" thread, and the recent conversation in that thread about how to react to misplaced threads or duplicate threads. It also changes the nature of how forum members interact with the forum, as we have always been encouraged to be a self-policing group, which goes a long way to making the forum what it is.

However, if every time a forum member wants to question something, they are being asked to do so by PM, that changes how this forum is to moderated.

I mean no disrespect to any mod here. I am having lunch with one tomorrow, where I am sure this will crop up.

It seems to me that there are two views here among the mods about how public the process of moderation should be: Whether it should continue to be the open discussion it has always been since I joined, or become a more closed doors thing that occurs via PM.

Myself, I prefer the more open discussion. I believe that is good for the community.

It would be good if the mods could discuss this and come to a common position though.

It is wrong of one mod to publicly criticise a forum user for acting in line with a public discussion on a thread that involves, and was started by, another mod.

@Joe @Ahhh Girl @meanmistermustard @Zig

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17 July 2016
9.49am
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Starr Shine?
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I think that it is an individual matter between one user it should be felt with as a PM first before going public so that there is lesss spotlight drawn to a problem that could be dealt with one on one.

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17 July 2016
10.18am
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Ron Nasty
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You're missing my point, @Starr Shine?. If duplicate or misplaced threads should only be addressed by PM, then "Mother Superior Jumped the Gun" should be a locked thread, and our discussion - and the agreement reached - about how to respond to duplicate or misplaced threads (which it can be argued the thread I highlighted was both) we should be told is wrong.

I do not believe you can have one mod asking for such concerns to only be raised by PM while another mod has created a thread that asks the opposite, and has involved a community discussion about what to do in threads we have concerns with.

If it's to be done by PM only, okay, lock "Mother Superior Jumped the Gun", but don't have a go when everything I did was in keeping with the discussion in that thread. You can have one or the other, but when you have both, which is right?

"I only said we were bigger than Rod... and now there's all this!" Ron Nasty

 

The Beatles Non-Canon Poll List

17 July 2016
10.48am
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Starr Shine?
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Maybe the mods could advocate a mixed approach of either using the thread or PMing a mod. Some people find it easier to PM and others find it easier to use the Mother Superior Jumped the Gun thread for that situation.

Though for that situation, I'm more on the side of using the Mother Superior Jumped the Gun thread since there could be differing opinions on the subject of the thread and threads are more a community thing than a post.

Though how open moderation is should depend on the situation.

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17 July 2016
10.52am
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Evangeline
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  For just moving threads and posts, etc... I think discussing those things by PM would be a nuisance, especially with the PM system being rather faulty at some points. 

  But for complaints about a post content or whatever, that should be reported in a private message. If it becomes a bigger problem it could be brought to the whole forum. 

(That was the question right?) 

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17 July 2016
11.05am
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Ron Nasty
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This is why I bring the situation up. You can, as you suggest, have two systems running parallel, with users choosing which they are most comfortable in the particular circumstances.

However, you cannot have one mod criticise a user for using the system set up by another mod.

This is why I am requesting the mods come to a common position. I don't particularly care whether it is one or the other or both. I just don't want a mod telling me I've got it wrong if both routes are acceptable. That Mod may prefer it that way, but it is not an agreed position, the existence of "Mother Superior" contradicts that position, and I don't want to be told by one mod that I'm doing it wrong when I'm following the path set out by another in consultation with forum members.

It's all I'm asking, have one route, two routes, whatever, but - as a mod - don't criticise users for not using your preferred method.

"I only said we were bigger than Rod... and now there's all this!" Ron Nasty

 

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18 July 2016
9.45am
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Joe
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OK, let's do this in public.

@Ron Nasty said
I was criticised in another thread for posting a possible problem with that thread, with the post suggesting I was ignoring mod requests to report such concerns by PM to the mods. This was stated as if it was agreed position between Joe and all the mods.

When a thread gets derailed by a discussion on what the selfsame discussion should be about, it creates a metaloop which makes it really hard to get things back on track. To save that happening, a quiet word with one of us is often the best approach.

In threads where the sole purpose is to discuss, say, existing threads or misplaced discussions, it's fine to use that instead. You're not going to derail a thread when you're using it for its intended function (I'm talking here about threads like Mother Superior jumped the gun - metathreads if you like).

I agree with @Starr Shine?. Sometimes things are best dealt with via PM (or email – the form to contact me directly via email is at the bottom of every page), while other things can be openly discussed. But generally I'd prefer that threads were kept for their declared purpose rather than becoming derailed. Otherwise we risk every off-topic post within a thread becoming the focus of that thread, when someone wants to point out a technicality. I don't have any problem with discussions on forum policy, but it really needs to be done in the appropriate place.

I do not believe you can have one mod asking for such concerns to only be raised by PM while another mod has created a thread that asks the opposite, and has involved a community discussion about what to do in threads we have concerns with.

In the case of the bestbeatlesbooks thread, I believe that @meanmistermustard was suggesting that it makes things cleaner if those sorts of discussions are done away from – rather than within – the topic:

meanmistermustard said
There is and are no hard deeply entrenched rules as there are always exceptions. As requested before if posts and threads are possibly requiring moved can the person highlighting it please PM the mods as it makes things so much easier and cleaner over having discussions on the forum which pull threads off-topic.

apple01   

 [emphasis mine]

In that particular case, discussing the thread within the thread pretty much rendered the whole thing unusable (although I agree with your concerns, RN). Perhaps MMM should have said "Please PM the mods or use the Mother Superior thread". We'll note that for the future.

Ron Nasty said
It is wrong of one mod to publicly criticise a forum user for acting in line with a public discussion on a thread that involves, and was started by, another mod.

[...]

However, you cannot have one mod criticise a user for using the system set up by another mod.

By 'system', are you talking about the Mother Superior thread? If so, I don't think any mods would criticise users for using it. That's what it's there for. Who's been criticised for using it?

Forgive me if I've missed out any important details.

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