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Announcement: Changes to All Together Now
7 March 2018
6.40am
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Joe
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My own view is that Impossible-to-derail should stay, and that it should remain true to its original purpose. It's one topic here that I really don't have a problem with. And I'd quite like things like world events to go in there – people can say their piece, others can respond, then it'll move on to the next concern.

This bears repeating, because it sums up precisely how I feel:

meanmistermustard said
For me, the big issue is that such discussions as daily news events are in their own thread. ITD will allow whoever to make sure people are safe and can discuss if they want just not in their separate threads, if you want to discuss it more there are a ton of external places online to discuss it all in depth, Anna's forum, thru PM. 

Currently, we have separate threads for philosophy, debates, controversial opinions, daily events and who knows what else, all of which can cover the same topics and there is no reason those cannot be continued in ITD, except for liking it all separate. And in truth do we really need to be having in-depth discussions on abortions, gun laws, consensual sex laws etc on a Beatles forum. The last conversation in here was about visitors potentially being put off by ATN ; walking in and finding a discussion on incest will have happened to some people. Even the most determined for ATN to not be touched cannot look at that and not think WTF!!!'. Saying "well, don't read that" misses the basic reason for there being a forum in the first place.

Our job as mods is to maintain and sustain the fundamental principles of the forum and one key principle is Joe's original vision of a Beatles forum which allows some [light] discussion on other topics. Somewhere along the line we have let that fall, now we are working to get that back. It's been comforting and reassuring to see the suggestions put forward and hopefully those will continue. Already we are seeing a direction to go for how to shape the forum for the better.  

Keep letting me know which threads you think you can't live without.

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7 March 2018
7.09am
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Ahhh Girl
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Evangeline said
Would nesting posts to the posts they are responding to, mean a lot of posts would be unread as they would be pages behind other current ones?
Then us people that are interested in reading that specific type of post would have to trawl through pages and pages to find the correct subject, and THEN find the right post?

Also, (maybe it's just me) I haven't noticed over the past few months many mundane asinine threads popping up. So I don't know why people keep going on about them when they're not even in use. a-hard-days-night-paul-10

In keeping a list of threads, core threads that promote human interaction are good. (All Purpose, In My Life , Beatle Bible House, Writing thread, etc...)

I also agree with @Von Bontee for keeping the Turn It Up/Down thread. I've found so many great songs from posting in there and I hope that others have found good music from my posts. I think it's a vital musical output thread (more so than the Listening thread) as people have to actually press play on the video you've posted and lay down a verdict on the song you've chosen.  

As to nesting, I don't think nesting would work that way. Joe, can you explain how nesting would look and work a little more for us? Or is there a description you can link to?

7 March 2018
10.23am
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sir walter raleigh
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What about a thread like the “Holy Trinities” thread? A user came in and asked a really interesting question, which drew many responses which i often still go back to in that particular thread. Will topics like these go away? Simple discussion topics that can stand on their own. 

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7 March 2018
4.10pm
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penny lane
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The Hole Got Fixed said
Sorry @Billy Rhythm but I have to derail this thread, as it seems that even if I posted this in the appropriate thread (the derail thread), you wouldn't read it. SO here it is:
You can't use ellipses as a full stop! An ellipsis, from wikipedia, 'indicates an intentional omission of a word, sentence, or whole section from a text without altering its original meaning.'
[...]
Those two sentences you wrote broke my head.

Sorry The Hole Got Fixed, but you can use it at the end of a sentence to indicate a pause or that you are pondering, or if you want to, even as a style choice! and enjoying breaking the rules a bit. But back on topic.

Ahhh Girl said
@Billy Rhythm, do you read any of the posts/threads in the All Together Now section or do you ignore them?

To those who have joined us lately, did ATN scare you? I wish we had a way to really know if people refused to join the forum because of ATN . Seems crazy to me if ATN keeps anyone from joining in the Beatles talk here (other than DO bring up vileness that I totally believe needs to be squished like a pimple on the face of the forum). No one is forced to read or reply to ATN . But, maybe I am in the minority.  

The small ills of the forum can be remedied. It isn't the fault of one (vulnerable) individual  member who was allowed to post inappropriately; but then improved? We are all responsible surely. We all want to make it a livelier, more interesting place to be and I hope the problems don't all just migrate north, to do the same with the Beatles section.

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7 March 2018
4.34pm
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PurplishRain
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I want to respectfully say that i am not a fan of where this is all going

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7 March 2018
5.03pm
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meanmistermustard
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Penny Lane said

The small ills of the forum can be remedied. It isn't the fault of one (vulnerable) individual  member who was allowed to post inappropriately; but then improved? We are all responsible surely. We all want to make it a livelier, more interesting place to be and I hope the problems don't all just migrate north, to do the same with the Beatles section.  

No one person or one thread is the cause of what is happening, it's why I, and others, have been careful not to refer to such members or specific posts. It's down to years and so many people, including us mods. I'll hold my hands up and say I have contributed to where the forum is. 

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7 March 2018
9.10pm
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Billy Rhythm
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Perhaps a better way of putting it is...  think of something that ALL of us can relate to in the Northern Hemisphere this time of year...  it's called 'Spring Cleaning'...  this is when you move things around a bit to tackle the crud that's been built up in the corners over the Winter...  whenever something doesn't quite belong under the headings provided, it often gets pushed into a favourite corner known as 'All Together Now ' where anything goes (not always such a good thing!)...  there's been a build-up of science experiments obstructing the view of one of them prized framed photos of the Fab Four rebelling against society...

Of course there's gonna be a shiny dime or two glistening amongst the dustpan nonsense...  just say "Wait "...  and separate the precious metals from the raw elements before they're tossed into the bin Forever...  now's the time to preserve them before it's too late!

Speak Now or Forever Hold Your Peace...

or...

If Ya Ain't Gotta Poop Get Off Of The Pot!...:-) 

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8 March 2018
2.49am
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Shamrock Womlbs
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Starr Shine? said

meanmistermustard said

Personally, I'd rather meld 'Turn it up/Down' with 'What are you listening to right now', i'm not too sure they both warrant a thread of their own. That's a personal opinion and not what is definitely going to happen. Others may think that is utterly stupid.  

One does, not the other. Both combined would be a mess like what happened with the life and what you doing right now. Only one was needed but both combined wasn't good.

I'd be like combining all the trivia game threads.  

^ I agree with that. Maybe combining those two would be a bit of a mess.
But i think the idea of adding subcategories to All together now could be a solution to the musical threads , though i could perfectly live without them or any other thread in ATN

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8 March 2018
2.52pm
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SgtPeppersBulldog
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Just wondering whether The Goons thread should be spared from the lockdown and moved to Yesterday And Today due to the Beatley connections mentioned in that thread. (I think I asked about this a while back but there was no response or I thought I remembered someone saying it was better off staying where it was, but at the same time it hasn't spawned any discussion since so it might deserve to be locked.)

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9 March 2018
12.12pm
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SpecialCup
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To me, the music threads are most essential, to share and discuss music and musicians.  I also quite like the instrument/songwriting and collaborative music threads because they are creative and positive.  I agree with Vera Chuckandave's earlier post about saving some space to discuss the arts.

For what it's worth, I have yet to post in them, but the derail thread and the current events threads Don't Bother Me at all.  I see them as distinct, that "derail" is for random musings and "news" is for social and political discussion.  I find interesting the differing perspectives on current events from posters in other parts of the world.  The Beatles were discouraged from speaking out on social and political issues, since they were "just entertainers," but they decided to say "screw it; we are going to say what we feel," and society was better for it.  So I like the idea of keeping the forum in the spirit of the Beatles.

I don't even understand what "Beatles Bible House" is.a-hard-days-night-ringo-7a-hard-days-night-ringo-10

Consolidating redundant threads would go quite far in cleaning things up.  Personally, I chafe at the idea that no posters will be permitted to start threads in ATN ever again.  Sorry, but it just seems so uptight.  To paraphrase Sir P. McCartney, "It's a bit like school, isn't it?"

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9 March 2018
1.29pm
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Starr Shine?
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"Beatles Bible House" is where the scummers live in a Beatles inspired house with elements of ourselves and the Beatles combined.

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9 March 2018
7.19pm
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PurplishRain
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i think we should take all of the topics about individual musicians and put them in a subforum rather than locking those

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10 March 2018
5.01pm
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WeepingAtlasCedars
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@Ahhh Girl said

We can lock the current derail thread away and make a new thread that isn't called Impossible to derail. We can set restrictions on what topics can be discussed.  

I see no point that justifies making another derail thread. Couldn't Zig just add an edit to his first post in the one we have, saying that controversial/etc. topics aren't allowed to be posted about there?

Another suggestion: Perhaps some very old threads that aren't really too active could be locked, at least ensuring that someone doesn't just go back and post in them all or something similar. Some threads could also be merged, for example the Led Zeppelin and Carry Fire threads.

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10 March 2018
5.58pm
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Dark Overlord
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I don't like that you're doing this but i definitely see why, as this is a Beatles forum and having the All Together Now thread the way it is turns people off from talking about The Beatles, especially if it's about politics and religion where stating your opinion can offend some. My recommendation would be having one thread to talk about bands that aren't The Beatles so instead of having separate threads for The Beach Boys , Queen, Pink Floyd, etc. we just have one big thread for it separate from the Incredibly Impossible thread. Also, instead of locking the derail thread, i recommend renaming it instead.

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10 March 2018
7.42pm
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Starr Shine?
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The Potentially Possible to Derail Thread

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12 March 2018
2.30am
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Ron Nasty
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Much as I disagree over aspects of this, while agreeing with others, I would like to see @Joe have the balls to close this conversation this week. There's no disputing that having this Sword of Damocles hanging over us has collapsed conversation over the last week - because nobody knows what ATN threads are acceptable to post in.

I would also like for William Shears Campbell's update thread to remain here. Though he has very reluctantly agreed to a move, I don't believe in retrospective bans, and I don't believe his ability to talk to the forum should be stopped because rules have changed while he's away. It's not like he can argue his own case at the moment, and he set up his route to talk to us in a way that was acceptable at the time.

I don't believe he should be stripped of having a voice because rules have changed. Ban someone doing it again, maybe, but banning someone communicating in the way they said they would many months after they said the way they have been, disgraceful.

Should William Shears Campbell's updates on what's going on with his life be moved or stay here as it doesn't changed rules he feels unable to argue because, as he announced months ago, before these changes were mooted, that this would be how he kept in touch with us all?

[sp_show_poll id="239"]

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12 March 2018
4.40am
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meanmistermustard
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No-one has been banned and there has been no conclusion on what threads remain open - the initial list Joe posted was tbc ("I proposed a core set of six threads in my first post here, but if people have a burning desire for more please speak up and say which ones."), certain threads were to be moved to wherever else suitable, and throughout Joe has said he is wanting discussion on what happens.  The conversation continues to allow people to say their points, the week deadline was extended.

It was yourself who said

Ron Nasty said
Being a Monday, @Shamrock Womlbs, I was able to exchange a couple of emails with WSC. He's disappointed by the news, but wanting his weeklies to continue, has agreed for them to appear on SS?'s forum. sir walter will start a new thread for them there in the next couple of days. We hope you will visit to keep up with his adventures.  

before a mod answered the question set by Shamrock Wolmbs.

"I told you everything I could about me, Told you everything I could" ('Before Believing' - Emmylou Harris) 

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12 March 2018
5.06am
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Ron Nasty
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And that the discussion was extended, @meanmistermustard, beyond what I thought @Joe would allow, means my request for a thread to remain open, as Joe has asked to request, makes your shooting down a total arsehole suggestion unless you have a valid reason why we should cut WSC off at the knees. Unless you have a valid reason for why he should stopped from communicating with the forum, on the basis that he ignored forum rules at the time, in my opinion, please feck off, because - so far as can see - you are against. Vote against if you're that arsehole, claim responsibility, but so far votes are showing people want WSC to remain here.

Where's your argument and reasoning it shouldn't be?

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The Beatles Non-Canon Poll List

12 March 2018
5.25am
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meanmistermustard
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Ron Nasty said
And that the discussion was extended, @meanmistermustard, beyond what I thought @Joe would allow, means my request for a thread to remain open, as Joe has asked to request, makes your shooting down a total arsehole suggestion unless you have a valid reason why we should cut WSC off at the knees. Unless you have a valid reason for why he should stopped from communicating with the forum, on the basis that he ignored forum rules at the time, in my opinion, please feck off, because - so far as can see - you are against. Vote against if you're that arsehole, claim responsibility, but so far votes are showing people want WSC to remain here.

Where's your argument and reasoning it shouldn't be?  

What?

The discussion has always been ongoing. Joe said in post six

Hey, look, we are interested in discussing it. That's why I've created this thread. I've introduced changes before without any forewarning or discussion, and been criticised for it, so I'm doing things differently this time.

No decision was made about SWR's thread, no mod ever said it should move or stay, no mod has ever had a problem with it on here, no forum rules have ever been broken with that thread. 

Shamrock Wolmbs asked if it would remain (post 18),

I was wondering if the thread about William Shares campbell updates could be kept until he rejoins/finishes his adventure.

you said in post 19 it would move.

Being a Monday, @Shamrock Womlbs, I was able to exchange a couple of emails with WSC. He's disappointed by the news, but wanting his weeklies to continue, has agreed for them to appear on SS?'s forum. sir walter will start a new thread for them there in the next couple of days. We hope you will visit to keep up with his adventures.

Why is that down to us mods (and Joe, who I include as a mod)?

"I told you everything I could about me, Told you everything I could" ('Before Believing' - Emmylou Harris) 

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12 March 2018
5.59am
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The Hole Got Fixed
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@Ron Nasty said
And that the discussion was extended, meanmistermustard, beyond what I thought Joe would allow, means my request for a thread to remain open, as Joe has asked to request, makes your shooting down a total arsehole suggestion unless you have a valid reason why we should cut WSC off at the knees. Unless you have a valid reason for why he should stopped from communicating with the forum, on the basis that he ignored forum rules at the time, in my opinion, please feck off, because - so far as can see - you are against. Vote against if you're that arsehole, claim responsibility, but so far votes are showing people want WSC to remain here.

Where's your argument and reasoning it shouldn't be?  

Hey, Hey, Hey, no swearing at mmm. I have agreed with almost all of what you have said until this post, which I find to be pretty shoddy behaviour. Calling a mod (who hasn't really done much wrong except for being the messenger, really) an 'arsehole' twice and telling him to 'feck off' is really banal and unnacceptable IMO. mmm is, by no stretch of the imagination, an arsehole. 

It's been pretty widely accepted WSC will still have his thread, whether it's in ATN or not. Please don't treat a mod like that. Actually, don't treat anyone like that. Keep it civil, and agreements will be made, and compromises will be achieved.

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