Please consider registering
Guest
sp_LogInOut Log In sp_Registration Register
Register | Lost password?
Advanced Search
Forum Scope


Match



Forum Options



Minimum search word length is 3 characters - maximum search word length is 84 characters
sp_Feed sp_TopicIcon
Do you think George really wanted to do the anthology documentary?
9 November 2018
7.15am
Avatar
Billy Rhythm
Shea Stadium
Members
Forum Posts: 953
Member Since:
22 December 2013
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
161sp_Permalink sp_Print

authorgary said
To a degree his Krishna persona was hypocritical – – to the same degree that Lennon’s peace talk was.

Couldn’t disagree more…  Of course they all had inflated egos…  it’s in the job description…  John & George both made tremendous strides in smashing away at their own big heads…  George was very devoted to the Krishna Movement, right up until his final days…  Anyone doubting John’s convictions has their own issues to deal with…  Yes, he was violent in his younger years and even revisited this during the ‘Lost Weekend’, but his experience only strengthened his hope for humanity…  When it comes to Spiritual “authenticity”, I think of George Harrison …  and when it comes to Hope for Humanity, I think of two people…  John Lennon & Yoko Ono…  War is Over, if You Want It…:-)

10 November 2018
10.03am
Avatar
authorgary
A Beginning
Members
Forum Posts: 2
Member Since:
7 November 2018
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Billy Rhythm said

authorgary said
To a degree his Krishna persona was hypocritical – – to the same degree that Lennon’s peace talk was.

Couldn’t disagree more…  Of course they all had inflated egos…  it’s in the job description…  John & George both made tremendous strides in smashing away at their own big heads…  George was very devoted to the Krishna Movement, right up until his final days…  Anyone doubting John’s convictions has their own issues to deal with…  Yes, he was violent in his younger years and even revisited this during the ‘Lost Weekend’, but his experience only strengthened his hope for humanity…  When it comes to Spiritual “authenticity”, I think of George Harrison …  and when it comes to Hope for Humanity, I think of two people…  John Lennon & Yoko Ono…  War is Over, if You Want It…:-)   

‘Couldn’t disagree more’ is under starter’s orders for a knee-jerk response. 

“Of course they all had inflated egos…  it’s in the job description…” doesn’t say anything other than All Successful Band Members Have Giant Egos- – lazy false thinking.  “George was very devoted to the Krishna Movement” does not refute his hypocrisy or his lack of awareness.  Sorry if he was a personal guru, but there it is.    

What has “Hope for humanity” got to do with it?  Hopefulness is no measure of how humanitarian someone is.  Hitler was tremendously hopeful for his idea of the human race – – but not much of a humanitarian.  Kurt Vonnegut was to the day he died pessimistic about mankind, and so was Mark Twain – – both of them consistently humanitarian in their life and writings.  

Yoko Ono didn’t show any peace initiatives when it came to mollifying the Beatle’s rifts.  There isn’t one known example from anyone of Yoko Ono trying in anyway to heal those rifts – – it was beyond her capacity to do so, of course, so I guess that exonerates her from trying, whereas I guess it was not beyond her capacity to save the world.  One thing she could have done to mollify the band’s friction was to stay out of the studio during recordings, despite Lennon’s ‘she’s with me’ Stage Pass.  She showed herself as remarkably oblivious as a sociopath to their space in the studio.  Linda Eastman noticed this, and so did George Harrison , who had her corporate number from 1968 right through the Nike adverts.  Next you’ll be telling us Yoko took heroin for Peace, and converted John on that account.  

Does this mean Yoko Ono cared not a jot for world peace?  No, it doesn’t mean that – – but it would be convenient for low-level thinkers to assume it did mean that, so they wouldn’t have to think too hard and couldn’t disagree more, etc.

“Anyone doubting John’s convictions has their own issues to deal with…”  One issue I don’t deal well with is ignoramuses – – I tend to call them on it.  You can hold convictions and be hypocritical at the same time – – Lennon knew this, and you’ll find that self-disclosure scattered in his lyrics and interviews.   It’s his risk-all honesty that made him different, not his convictions.  His ‘count me out…in’ ambivalence followed whatever trend he was in that year.  His wealth and socialism is one conflicted area, for example.  Lennon wasn’t Jesus, despite announcing himself as such in one Apple meeting, and you’re not an Apostle and I’m not Judas.  Scepticism is a good thing to learn.  

What is palpable in the Anthology is how fragile was the dynamic of the surviving three and the ghost of the fourth – -all of them, even including PM, looking vulnerable, on the spot.  Fallible.  Not able to live up to the camera’s expectations.  Too much hero-worship for the members of the best band in the world.    

 

   

10 November 2018
12.38pm
Avatar
Billy Rhythm
Shea Stadium
Members
Forum Posts: 953
Member Since:
22 December 2013
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
163sp_Permalink sp_Print

yep…  “knee-jerk response” is a good name for it…:-)

The following people thank Billy Rhythm for this post:

all things must pass
21 May 2020
4.11am
Avatar
all things must pass
Decca
Members
Forum Posts: 95
Member Since:
30 May 2018
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
164sp_Permalink sp_Print

bewareofchairs said
I think Peter Doggett summed up George and Paul’s relationship really well: 

“As an observer/outsider, my take on McCartney’s relationship with Harrison was that Paul couldn’t understand what it was that kept upsetting George so much; and the more he tried to do things differently, the more George resented it. It’s very difficult in life to escape unconscious patterns of behaviour, even if you know (rationally, consciously) that they don’t work for you or those around you. I don’t think George could stop feeling hurt by Paul; I don’t think Paul could stop treating George like a junior partner. They almost needed to rethink their neural connections, which is the work of therapy or something equally profound. Saying to yourself, “I must take George more seriously” isn’t going to do it. […] Underneath it all, I believe that Paul sincerely loved George; and at some level George loved Paul as well. But they had a hard time expressing it.”

Of all the Beatle pairings, their relationship was unique because they met when they were very young, and Paul wasn’t old enough for George to look up to him like he did John. I think when that dynamic of person A having more power/control over person B is developed at such a young age, it’s very difficult for it to change, especially when person A goes on to become part of a legendary partnership. Based on various quotes I’ve read, I get the impression George always had a great amount of love and respect for Paul, but his perspective on who Paul was as a person would be totally different from everyone elses.

I kind of hate this book, but there’s a passage about the Anthology period in George Harrison : Behind the Locked Door which is pretty telling:

“George was mixing something down in his studio and McCartney came in,” says Geoff Wonfor. “He said, ‘Ah that sounds nice, George. When the f*** did you learn to do all this?’ George looked up and said, ‘Remember me? I was second on the right’.” It was not a one way street. With Lennon no longer around, Harrison felt obliged to take on the role of agent provocateur; he was heard to utter heretical views about the quality of the raw material they were working with, and hoped that “someone does this with all my crap demos when I’m dead.” McCartney, pulling rank on baby Beatle, “personally thought that a little presumptuous.”

Another thing to keep in mind is that George was going through a pretty rough time in his personal life in the 90’s, which wouldn’t have helped his mood.

  

‘Remember me? I was second on the right’.” Woh!!!loved it!

21 May 2020
4.58am
Avatar
all things must pass
Decca
Members
Forum Posts: 95
Member Since:
30 May 2018
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
165sp_Permalink sp_Print

Whenever the three of them are together, it’s clear Harrison is the Alpha

C.R.A. said

bewareofchairs said

I suspect he wanted him to go back to being the Paul he knew before he became Beatle Paul and before he was half of Lennon/McCartney.

Coincidentally, I’m watching Anthology (currently on the final chapters) and have watched the extras.  People can be influenced by the perception of others; I certainly didn’t see… or actually should say, recognize… any animosity between George and Paul, the first time I watched it.  This time ’round, I seem to be detecting it.

The largest contributor to any animosity between these two could be precisely because of what you said; he views Paul as Paul; the kid he knew over on Forthlin Road, the kid he went to school with, the one he went hitchhiking with and the one who was his friend, long before McCartney grew into Beatle Paul, a persona McCartney longed for and would never let go of.

Wigwam said

Paul dances on egg-shells all the way through.

While a second viewing is being influenced by others to notice Harrison’s ill-ease during some moments, this has been noticeable from the very first time.  You would expect McCartney to be dominant, but he’s not.  I think that has a lot to do with his overall “performance” here.  He becomes annoying simply because he’s not dominant.  If he had been, you could be irate or have your expectations met.  His waffling becomes annoying, where you start to dismiss his dialog.

 

Whenever the three of them are together, it’s clear Harrison is the Alpha.  I found that hugely ironic.

  

“Whenever the three of them are together, it’s clear Harrison is the Alpha”
That’s my impression too.

The following people thank all things must pass for this post:

kelicopter
18 June 2020
6.47am
castironshore
London Palladium
Members
Forum Posts: 194
Member Since:
12 May 2015
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
166sp_Permalink sp_Print

“my take on McCartney’s relationship with Harrison was that Paul couldn’t understand what it was that kept upsetting George so much; and the more he tried to do things differently, the more George resented it.”

 

I think that’s a particularly good way of framing it. 

You can see a wee flavour of that in the kitchen chat in the anthology, George starts talking about his hair in Hamburg and how he combed it forward after coming back from the swimming pool, but before he could expand on how he got his Beatle cut, immediately Paul moved it on to a lengthy discourse on him and John getting their hair done during their trip to Paris. When the camera cut back to George he had his ukulele in his hands.

I worked with a guy like that, who just couldn’t help himself trying to trump any experience I had with one of his own or would just divert every discussion to being about him and his life. He actually didn’t know he was doing it and Paul seems to have the same problem. 

The following people thank castironshore for this post:

all things must pass, Shamrock Womlbs
18 June 2020
12.04pm
Avatar
kelicopter
Sitting in an English Garden
Shea Stadium
Members
Forum Posts: 871
Member Since:
6 November 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
167sp_Permalink sp_Print

“Whenever the three of them are together, it’s clear Harrison is the Alpha”

 

I love all these observations of how George had almost outgrown the others at this point. My favourite example of this is a clip from Living In The Material World (although I think originally from the Anthology meetings but may need to rewatch) – Paul walks into the room and as they greet each other, George says “so this is a vegetarian leather jacket?” And Paul sort of pulls a face and gestures with the jacket, but doesn’t quite know what to say back! In one quick witted remark, George absolutely takes control, it’s brilliant!

The following people thank kelicopter for this post:

sir walter raleigh, all things must pass, Shamrock Womlbs

I think it's great you're going through a phase,

and I'm awfully glad it'll all be over in a couple

of days

 

funniestpost-3.png 2020

2 December 2020
12.57am
Avatar
Timothy
Nutopia
Candlestick Park
Members
Forum Posts: 1661
Member Since:
14 June 2016
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
168sp_Permalink sp_Print

kelicopter said
“Whenever the three of them are together, it’s clear Harrison is the Alpha”

I love all these observations of how George had almost outgrown the others at this point. My favourite example of this is a clip from Living In The Material World (although I think originally from the Anthology meetings but may need to rewatch) – Paul walks into the room and as they greet each other, George says “so this is a vegetarian leather jacket?” And Paul sort of pulls a face and gestures with the jacket, but doesn’t quite know what to say back! In one quick witted remark, George absolutely takes control, it’s brilliant!

  

I’m glad the band broke up, but it still would’ve been fascinating to have seen a reformed Beatles (all four of them) with George having this no Fs given persona. 

1.The Beatles 2.Sgt. Pepper 3.Abbey Road 4.Magical Mystery Tour 5.Rubber Soul 6.Revolver 7.Help! 8.Let It Be
9.A Hard Day’s Night 10.Please Please Me 11.Beatles For Sale 12.With The Beatles 13.Yellow Submarine

2020 Most Avid John Fan: john.png

2 December 2020
5.19am
Avatar
meanmistermustard
Thankfully not where I am.
Moderator
Members

Reviewers


Moderators
Forum Posts: 24046
Member Since:
1 May 2011
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

In the ‘Anthology’ series you can tell George is taking it all it for a laugh; he knows how good the Beatles were and for him that’s enough so therefore he spends most of the time enjoying himself, if it starts becoming a hassle at any time he does something else. Paul meantime is trying so hard to underplay it all and fails miserably. Of them all, George came out by far the best. George’s irreverence to it all at times is what I mean.

The following people thank meanmistermustard for this post:

kelicopter, sir walter raleigh, all things must pass

"I told you everything I could about me, Told you everything I could" ('Before Believing' - Emmylou Harris)

3 December 2020
2.07am
Avatar
sir walter raleigh
In our yellow (IN OUR YELLOW) submarine (SUBMARINE AHA!)
Apple rooftop
Members
Forum Posts: 5574
Member Since:
26 January 2017
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
170sp_Permalink sp_Print

I agree with that. Do I think he WANTED to do it? No. Did he mind being involved? I don’t think so. The real love music video shows George seemingly very satisfied playing another Beatles guitar solo, something that may not be said about a man who is bitter about their career. 

The following people thank sir walter raleigh for this post:

all things must pass

"The pump don't work cause the vandals took the handles!"

-Bob Dylan, Subterranean Homesick Blues

"We could ride and surf together while our love would grow"

-Brian Wilson, Surfer Girl

3 December 2020
3.28am
Avatar
meanmistermustard
Thankfully not where I am.
Moderator
Members

Reviewers


Moderators
Forum Posts: 24046
Member Since:
1 May 2011
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
171sp_Permalink sp_Print

It’s always been false to say George was bitter about their career. He didn’t need or want Beatles getting shoved down his throat every minute he was in the presence of the press and he had bad experiences that meant he had no desire to return but by all accounts he was happy to talk about the band if it came up in natural conversations with his friends in private. George did meet up with Paul, Ringo and John occasionally and enjoyed it, he just didn’t need all the hysteria that came with it or be reminded every time he breathed. 

The following people thank meanmistermustard for this post:

sir walter raleigh, all things must pass, Richard

"I told you everything I could about me, Told you everything I could" ('Before Believing' - Emmylou Harris)

3 December 2020
4.41am
Avatar
sir walter raleigh
In our yellow (IN OUR YELLOW) submarine (SUBMARINE AHA!)
Apple rooftop
Members
Forum Posts: 5574
Member Since:
26 January 2017
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

At one point or another each Beatle was unhappy with the lifestyle forced upon them by their unprecedented stardom. John is the only one who seems like he was genuinely pissed him off to the point of resenting The Beatles

The following people thank sir walter raleigh for this post:

kelicopter

"The pump don't work cause the vandals took the handles!"

-Bob Dylan, Subterranean Homesick Blues

"We could ride and surf together while our love would grow"

-Brian Wilson, Surfer Girl

Forum Timezone: America/Chicago
Most Users Ever Online: 700
Currently Online:
Guest(s) 1
Top Posters:
Starr Shine?: 16072
Ron Nasty: 11631
Zig: 9832
50yearslate: 8722
Necko: 7961
AppleScruffJunior: 7484
parlance: 7111
mr. Sun king coming together: 6403
Mr. Kite: 6147
trcanberra: 6064
Member Stats:
Guest Posters: 88
Members: 2696
Moderators: 5
Admins: 1
Forum Stats:
Groups: 3
Forums: 44
Topics: 5067
Posts: 361967
Newest Members:
iburiedsauce, JDEMARCO, ImmaBeatlesfan12345, SavoyMuffin, indigo_dave
Moderators: Joe: 5261, meanmistermustard: 24046, Ahhh Girl: 20287, Beatlebug: 17675, The Hole Got Fixed: 8317
Administrators: Joe: 5261