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Philosophy
26 January 2017
5.29pm
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William Shears Campbell
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@Pablo Ramon said

All that and still 1,000 times more sane than the Mormons.  

That's funny, because being a Mormon for a little over 3 years I've come to realize that we're probably sanest group of Christians.

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26 January 2017
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Starr Shine?
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Living by the Bible is contradictory.

You would have to carefully look at the labels of your clothing, if they are different, can't wear them.

https://youtu.be/52nwiTs7bk8

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26 January 2017
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Pablo Ramon
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William Shears Campbell said

That's funny, because being a Mormon for a little over 3 years I've come to realize that we're probably sanest group of Christians.  

Well I am open to the idea that I have been misinformed...golden plates? Magic underwear? 

I don't mean to be cavalier - there is plenty I don't know, and theologically speaking three separate entities are certainly no worse than a holy trinity... 

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26 January 2017
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@Pablo Ramon said

Well I am open to the idea that I have been misinformed...golden plates? Magic underwear? 

I don't mean to be cavalier - there is plenty I don't know, and theologically speaking three separate entities are certainly no worse than a holy trinity...   

Well it's not that crazy, considering some of the things that happen in the Bible. Also I've never really understood the whole holy trinity thing. Even before I converted to Mormonism, I always thought that they were 3 separate beings.

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26 January 2017
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Pablo Ramon
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Starr Shine? said
Living by the Bible is contradictory.

You would have to carefully look at the labels of your clothing, if they are different, can't wear them.  

I don't understand and what you mean...can you explain?

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What are they? Whatever you believe since religion is what you believe.

https://youtu.be/52nwiTs7bk8

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27 January 2017
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Starr Shine? said
Living by the Bible is contradictory.

You would have to carefully look at the labels of your clothing, if they are different, can't wear them.  

If you mean the Old Testament laws etc they were fulfilled (for lack of better word) by the teachings in the New Testament. The Old Testament is generally viewed as Man trying to be clean from sin thru their actions however it never worked, it was therefore surpassed by Jesus dying on the Cross - Jesus dying for our sins, taking our place on the cross and therefore our punishment. If you believe in Jesus doing so then you're sin is washed away (but you cannot therefore just do what you please and pop off to Heaven when you die).

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27 January 2017
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If you can't do what you please, then didn't Jesus die in vain since you still have sin?

Also, if he took your place on the cross and your punishment, why is there still hell?

If punishment is already done, there wouldn't be eternally punishment still.

Where does it say in the Bible that the old testament is null and void?

https://youtu.be/52nwiTs7bk8

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27 January 2017
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Disclaimer: This sounds awful preachy and intended to convert. That is not intended, I just don't know how else to write it aside from writing "They believe" every 5 seconds. 

Starr Shine? said
If you can't do what you please, then didn't Jesus die in vain since you still have sin?

We have sin as we are sinful fallen beings and all have free will to do as we please. That's why it's your decision to accept Christ or not. It's not by our works but what Christ did on the Cross; he took the punishment we deserve for our sin so we don't have to. That's the Good News. Even if you have accepted Christ you still have sin but you believe that it is paid for. You also don't willfully continue as you did previously as there should be repentance and turning away from those ways.

Starr Shine? said

Also, if he took your place on the cross and your punishment, why is there still hell?

Hell is said to be eternal separation from God . Humans are heading there, God sent his Son so you don't have to end up there.

For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him.

John 3:16-17

 

Starr Shine? said

If punishment is already done, there wouldn't be eternally punishment still.

The punishment is eternal separation from God . It's about what happens next and that comes back to faith in what Christ did. 

For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

(Romans 6:23)

Starr Shine? said

Where does it say in the Bible that the old testament is null and void? 

It's not null and void, it is fulfilled.

Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them.

Matthew 5:17

The Old Testament is God concealed. The New Testament is God revealed.

 

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27 January 2017
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I hate all organized religions with a passion.

I think there is a force of creativity that lies outside of human understanding. Human made religions are just trappings put on that "force" to fulfill some people's desire to understand the un-understandable. Just let it be. Just relax and let your mind float downstream where ever it will go. That's my "spirituality".

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27 January 2017
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We have sin as we are sinful fallen beings and all have free will to do as we please.

What is sin to you? And why is it sin?

https://youtu.be/52nwiTs7bk8

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27 January 2017
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Starr Shine? said

We have sin as we are sinful fallen beings and all have free will to do as we please.

What is sin to you? And why is it sin?  

This is not about me but I'm not going to write "The Bible says" before or after everything.

You said 

Starr Shine? said
Living by the Bible is contradictory.

You would have to carefully look at the labels of your clothing, if they are different, can't wear them.  

I then answered based on what the Bible says and a conversation was begun. 

As for what it is sin, it is giving into our own desires instead of following the Two Commandments as stated by Christ

“‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’ This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’ All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.”

(Matthew: 22:37-40)

which encapsulates the Ten given by God to Moses in Exodus. All humans fall short. It goes back to before Adam and Eve

Therefore, just as sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, and in this way death came to all people, because all sinned—

To be sure, sin was in the world before the law was given, but sin is not charged against anyone’s account where there is no law. Nevertheless, death reigned from the time of Adam to the time of Moses, even over those who did not sin by breaking a command, as did Adam, who is a pattern of the one to come.

(Romans 5:12-14)

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27 January 2017
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Pablo Ramon
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Ahhh Girl said
I hate all organized religions with a passion.

I think there is a force of creativity that lies outside of human understanding. Human made religions are just trappings put on that "force" to fulfill some people's desire to understand the un-understandable. Just let it be. Just relax and let your mind float downstream where ever it will go. That's my "spirituality".  

I was half-heartedly raised as a catholic (dad = atheist, mom = bargain counter catholic) and I always believed that organized religion (in addition to fulfilling needs for community and ritual and tradition) serves as a shortcut for imposing morality on children. It's way easier to say "do bad things and you'll go to hell" than to try to teach social and ethical responsibility from purely secular concepts.

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27 January 2017
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ahdn_paul_06 I'd rather they do it with Santa Claus.

27 January 2017
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Pablo Ramon said

I was half-heartedly raised as a catholic (dad = atheist, mom = bargain counter catholic) and I always believed that organized religion (in addition to fulfilling needs for community and ritual and tradition) serves as a shortcut for imposing morality on children. It's way easier to say "do bad things and you'll go to hell" than to try to teach social and ethical responsibility from purely secular concepts.  

Was she told when she was young that pain would lead to pleasure?
Did she understand it when they said
That a man must break his back to earn his day of leisure?
Will she still believe it when he's dead?

('Girl' - The Beatles)

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27 January 2017
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Ahhh Girl said
ahdn_paul_06 I'd rather they do it with Santa Claus.  

They do and it's horrendous. If ever you want to see children being condescended to go to church at Christmas or Easter. 

I remember being in a secondary school assembly (would have been about 12 years old) and some Minister talking to us for about 20 minutes on the Easter Bunny before relating it to the Bible. 

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27 January 2017
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So to you meanmistermustard, the only really important part of the bible is the actions and words of Jesus?

https://youtu.be/52nwiTs7bk8

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27 January 2017
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Starr Shine? said
So to you meanmistermustard, the only really important part of the bible is the actions and words of Jesus?  

Not sure why you are hung up on me. You said the Bible is contradictory, I have shown it is not. The Law (clothes, animals, how to live) were put in place so Man could be right with God but it didn't work. Man cannot save himself from his own sin thru his own works. Jesus therefore came to do it on behalf of Man and it is faith in him that brings your salvation. That is what the Bible teaches.

Anyway to continue on this path.

No.

 All Scripture is God -breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, so that the servant of God  may be thoroughly equipped for every good work. 

(2 Timothy 3:16)

However some believe the words of Christ are more authoritative hence why in some Bibles they are in red.

Related imageImage Enlarger

 

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27 January 2017
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Ahhh Girl said
ahdn_paul_06 I'd rather they do it with Santa Claus.  

As parents, we started out very earnestly telling our first child there was no Santa Claus. Her need for this magical figure in her life at that point was so intense that she rejected our honesty out of hand and simply continued to believe in Santa until she was about 9. We have indulged the fiction for subsequent kids and, I will admit, even occasionally used the old fat man as a disciplinary tool when we were just too tired to do things the "right" way. Frankly, it only really works in the month of December anyway, which is the period when parents are at their weakest and most exhausted.

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Not sure why you are hung up on me.

Because it is what you believe that is important. Since your beliefs are in your head and everyone is different, therefore no two people have the same beliefs.

https://youtu.be/52nwiTs7bk8

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