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Philosophy
16 October 2018
7.45pm
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Ron Nasty
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See, I don't think you can make those distinctions, @Dark Overlord. The "average person" at that time, to elevate themselves in society and give better prospects, would probably have done all that CC did and more, and the vast majority of them would have applauded them for claiming new lands for whoever their ruler was. The majority of early explorers were, in terms modern morality, extremely questionable. By today's standards, exploration of the world usually included brutal and illegal subjugation of foreign lands. That wasn't the world they lived in though.

Find me an explorer from that time who acted differently.

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17 October 2018
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Tony Japanese
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@Ron Nasty Your comments remind me of the recent (i.e. earlier this year) events at Manchester University where the Rudyard Kipling poem, 'If' was painted over by students.

https://www.theguardian.com/ed.....ling-mural

https://www.theguardian.com/bo.....acist-past

30 October 2018
12.41pm
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Dark Overlord
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What are your thoughts on open borders. I think there should be no physical borders aside from a sign that says Welcome to (whatever country is being entered).

Borders are a horrible thing, they prevent people from truly being free to explore the world, they lock people into a specific area, they deny people who live in a shitty country the chance to enjoy basic rights, and if you have someone like Trump (or worse) in power, they can be used for racist purposes like the Muslim Ban.

Don't get me wrong, there are some legitimate reasons to have borders, such as to prevent mass shootings, but some of the worst mass shootings were done by American citizens and for every person who would do such a thing, there's thousands of innocent people trapped in countries where basic rights are denied, whether it be because of a corrupt government or because the country is 3rd world, who just want a better place to live and I don't think those people deserve to suffer because of the bad choices of a few people.

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30 October 2018
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The Hole Got Fixed
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I totally agree that all borders should be open - it's simply segregating people using an arbitrary border which commonly cuts through culture/language/communities. 

Oh, by the way, this post was made by The Hole Got Fixed!

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31 October 2018
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Tony Japanese
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Imagine there's no countries
It isn't hard to do

Trying to play Devil's advocate here:

The trouble with having no borders is that there's a danger that it would lead to mass immigration to a country/area that may not be able to cope with the increased demand on its services. Even a first-world country doesn't have the infrastructure to cope with a limitless population. Where will they all live? What jobs will they do? Where will they be educated? Where will they be be treated for illness or disease?

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31 October 2018
9.58am
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Dark Overlord
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We'd legalize all drugs, destroying the Mexican drug cartels in the process, which would improve the living situation in Mexico which would make less people want to immigrate to the US.

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24 December 2018
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Dark Overlord
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While we've briefly mentioned this issue a couple of times, we haven't truly gone in-depth on it.

What are your guys thoughts on recreational drug use, including but not limited to marijuana. I think it should be legalized for a few reasons.

First, it's about freedom, i think you should have the right to do whatever you want as long as your not hurting anyone else.

Also, these drugs typically come from either drug cartels or the mob so when you buy drugs illegally, you might start associating with these gangs and participate in gang violence. Not to mention, drug dealers may also participate in other illegal purchases such as selling stolen goods or human trafficking. If we legalize drugs, then we can destroy these drug cartels and reduce gang violence.

Then there's the problem of throwing these people in jail for simply using drugs. The main problem is that prison often hardens criminals, so you may be a good caring person who's in there for possessing cocaine and come out a member of a violent gang.

But the big problem is safety. We can't regulate drugs if they're illegal, we can't put an age limit on them, nor a purchase limit, so it's far easier for someone to misuse drugs and overdose. Also, there's the issue of drug poisoning, which can be eliminated if these drugs are produced legally.

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24 December 2018
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sir walter raleigh
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Those match my views on the issue pretty closely. While the drug problem in America would not be solved completely thriugh legalization, we would see many less unnecessary incarcerations as well as fewer drug related violent crimes, and hopefully less accidental ODs from dirty drugs. 

"The pump don't work cause the vandals took the handles!"

-Bob Dylan, Subterranean Homesick Blues

"We could ride and surf together while our love would grow"

-Brian Wilson, Surfer Girl

24 December 2018
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50yearslate
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sir walter raleigh said
Those match my views on the issue pretty closely. While the drug problem in America would not be solved completely thriugh legalization, we would see many less unnecessary incarcerations as well as fewer drug related violent crimes, and hopefully less accidental ODs from dirty drugs.   

Agreed.

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24 December 2018
11.57pm
Wigwam
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Dark Overlord said
What are your thoughts on open borders. I think there should be no physical borders aside from a sign that says Welcome to (whatever country is being entered).

Borders are a horrible thing, they prevent people from truly being free to explore the world, they lock people into a specific area, they deny people who live in a shitty country the chance to enjoy basic rights, and if you have someone like Trump (or worse) in power, they can be used for racist purposes like the Muslim Ban.

Don't get me wrong, there are some legitimate reasons to have borders, such as to prevent mass shootings, but some of the worst mass shootings were done by American citizens and for every person who would do such a thing, there's thousands of innocent people trapped in countries where basic rights are denied, whether it be because of a corrupt government or because the country is 3rd world, who just want a better place to live and I don't think those people deserve to suffer because of the bad choices of a few people.  

 

From space if the Earth is looked at......No borders......Lovely. But I'm afraid we're stuck with borders. I've been watching 'Dynasties' wonderful glimpse into the lives of Chimps, wild Dogs Lions and Tigers. They spend a great part of their time scent marking their.....er....borders....They will defend them with all the might they can muster.

Go back 350 million years and Jordan Peterson's first chapter is devoted to the humble lobster. It's society is hierarchical.......Marking out the best territories and defending them from all comers. It's been proven that neurologically we are wired in the same way.

Listen to the bird song in the morning.....It's saying 'keep out you sneaky buggars....or you're getting beaked!"

There's no altruistic justice in this.......Might is right in the animal world. It's a downright shame that we can't all live in the same space together happily ever after.  

You sound a lovely person Dark O......but....

Do you have walls around your property?.......Locks on your doors? If so what for?

Don't feel bad about it if you do. Today is the supposed birthday of a great man.....His harshest advice needs to be considered......(Whether he lived or not).

It's called the Mathew Principle..Mat 25:29......."to those who have everything more will be given; from those who have nothing everything will be taken."

Nature evolves.....it keeps and develops and builds on it's successes Bat wings get bigger, bird's beaks adapt, fins grow.....If we're territorial still it will be serving some purpose.

It's not necessary for anyone to agree, I'm an old fart and don't know any better......But if you really don't agree then take your locks off your doors and leave your house or apartment open to anyone that wants in.

25 December 2018
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Dark Overlord
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But there's a difference. My house is private property, owned by a select few or even 1 person. A country on the other hand is a gigantic landmass that belongs to millions of people. Not to mention that the majority of the citizens living in the US, Canada, Australia, and New Zealand aren't even native to their respective country but rather are European immigrants.

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25 December 2018
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The Hole Got Fixed
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Slight wording issue there DO

Dark Overlord said
But there's a difference. My house is private property, owned by a select few or even 1 person. A country on the other hand is a gigantic landmass that belongs to millions of people. Not to mention that the majority of the citizens living in the US, Canada, Australia, and New Zealand aren't even native to their respective country but rather are European immigrants.  

Few people are European immigrants anymore, however most are descendants. But if you delve into history, anyone that isn't from Africa isn't native to their homeland, so where do you draw the line, after how many generations?

 

*I do agree with your argument though

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25 December 2018
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Dark Overlord
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Oops, i meant most of us descended from European immigrants, my bad.

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25 December 2018
7.53pm
Wigwam
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Dark Overlord said
But there's a difference. My house is private property, owned by a select few or even 1 person. A country on the other hand is a gigantic landmass that belongs to millions of people. Not to mention that the majority of the citizens living in the US, Canada, Australia, and New Zealand aren't even native to their respective country but rather are European immigrants.  

The Native Americans had different tribes........and kept other tribes away from their hunting lands.

Hard wired you see.......

And as much as any land can be owned.....(Even when we are put in it it's never ours)....Countries are sovereign territory. Those that live on it, and can vote, vote for a Government who's prime responsibility is to protect its citizens from non-citizens.

I agree in as much as I think borders sometimes cause wars but they also stop wars.....Go figure!

As for those nasty English speaking invaders.....You just listed the, freest, fairest most desirable places on earth to have had the luck to be born in. One time or another there have been wars fought to preserve that luck.

Open borders is a lovely, but daft idea. Open them up by all means but forget English and Spanish............ learn mandarine.  

 

In case you see me as the board's version of Diogenes screaming nastiness and unpalatable truths to the world from a barrel, (and I can understand if you do).........  I'm not a cynic. Well it's not how I see myself. I believe love is the most powerful force even in this troubled world.

Don't believe in much else though ............Bit like John.......It boiled down to...

'Just Yoko and me...and that's reality'

25 December 2018
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The Hole Got Fixed
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Wigwam said

Open borders is a lovely, but daft idea. Open them up by all means but forget English and Spanish............ learn mandarine.  

Nice typo...

Daft, you say? I haven't seen an issue with the open borders in the EU. In fact, some incredibly peaceful countries are in the EU open borders list...

Oh, by the way, this post was made by The Hole Got Fixed!

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26 December 2018
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The Hole Got Fixed said

Wigwam said
Open borders is a lovely, but daft idea. Open them up by all means but forget English and Spanish............ learn mandarine.  

Nice typo...

Daft, you say? I haven't seen an issue with the open borders in the EU. In fact, some incredibly peaceful countries are in the EU open borders list...  

All 26 countries in the Schengen region actually have borders.......

Here's a list as of Oct 2018: Austria, Belgium, Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Finland, France, Germany, Greece, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Liechtenstein, Lithuania, Luxembourg, Malta, Netherlands, Norway, Poland, Portugal, Slovakia, Slovenia, Spain, Sweden, and Switzerland. 

I'll grant you that apart from the 'Cod wars' Iceland has been pretty peaceful......perhaps due to it's remoteness do you think?

Switzerland protects it's neutrality with borders that can be shut down overnight, a population that's allowed to keep it's military weapons at home, high level of self-sufficiency and a militia armed with some very clever pen-knives.

Though wiki lists a catalog of conflicts..https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/....._in_Europe     You can see none of the above have always been peaceful, far from it in fact  The founding of the interdependence of Europe was precisely to foster peace.....You could make a good case for that having worked.  The EU won a Nobel Peace prize I recall. But the reality is that NATO is the real reason for relative peace since WWII ..

Civil unrest in France recently has taken the focus off Italy., Greece etc.......But it's early days.

Merkel deciding unilaterally to 'Open the doors let 'em in' may have been a good thing to do, a good feeling, warm fuzzy type of action but it wasn't the right thing to do. Those fleeing war zones were economic migrants.....Country shoppers, eschewing safety in the countries who's welfare systems didn't cut the mustard and marching on and on until claiming asylum in their country of preference. Still not having children Merkel  doesn't have a stake in the future and unrest based on religious bigotry in Europe is a certainty......

I know I'm risking offending people here.......It's not my intention. Just giving an argument based on what can be observed....Not aiming for End of Year popularity.

A personal opinion......No one need pay attention. I don't expect any support either.

To finish with a positive thought. Ideas can't be put in prison ......No walls can contain them. China will find this out if Google could only play fair.

And last of all good music knows no barriers..........Russians smuggling Beatles songs etched onto X-ray film rolled up and hidden in the sleeves of coats proved that.

PS sorry about the typo.......Made me laugh though.

26 December 2018
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Dark Overlord
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I think these set of photos would be of interest.

https://designyoutrust.com/201.....in-europe/

These photos were taken less than 3 years ago and they show there's no borders between these countries.

As for the EU conflicts, most of those happened centuries ago, even you admitted that the EU have been good friends since then.

Why would any of us be offended, all you're doing is stating an opposing political view.

Like the founding fathers said, i disagree with what you're saying but i'll fight to the death to ensure your right to say it.

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26 December 2018
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Dark Overlord said

Like the founding fathers said, i disagree with what you're saying but i'll fight to the death to ensure your right to say it.  

I thought it was Voltaire who said that?

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26 December 2018
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This is a pretty good argument against an authoritarian position on drugs. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?.....JUXLqNHCaI

Personally, I feel that drugs can be pretty dangerous, but most of the danger tends to come from the lack of regulation i.e something less harmful like a marijuana cigarette getting laced with something harder, which would be more preventable if we could regulate what gets produced and sold. 

Plus, it seems pretty stupid that alcohol, which can be extremely damaging to someone's health and behaviour (alcohol often makes people aggressive and belligerent), is perfectly acceptable to the same people who shun marijuana for the same reasons.

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26 December 2018
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Dark Overlord said
I think these set of photos would be of interest.

https://designyoutrust.com/201.....in-europe/

These photos were taken less than 3 years ago and they show there's no borders between these countries.

As for the EU conflicts, most of those happened centuries ago, even you admitted that the EU have been good friends since then.

Why would any of us be offended, all you're doing is stating an opposing political view.

Like the founding fathers said, i disagree with what you're saying but i'll fight to the death to ensure your right to say it.  

Thank you 'DO'

But don't get me started on the EU and Brexit Ha Ha.

As we're being all 'Feresophical' here......Something I've noticed.

It takes an awful lot for anyone to change their opinions, in fact it rarely occurs in a flash. Only time slowly, imperceptibly can bring that about.

For me, I think the changes that have happened in my thinking over the years  have been brought about by an understanding of the fact that there's just too much in life  to ever know!.....  I've realised that I've leaned in-turn on beliefs and knowledge to get along. Beliefs are passionately held on to. Or everything falls apart.

As I've aged, (God I've aged!)....... I've read more, listened more, seen more, understood more......and now need rely less on 'belief' 

When you're 66 'DO' maybe you'll look back at the changes in your thinking and recall, 'Oh yeah I remember that daft old buggar on Beatles Bible noticed that happening to him.

Whatever........... still believe in Beatles. For sure John did too.

Enjoy what's left of the 12 days of Christmas......maybe you'll have an epiphany in about 9 days.

Cheers........Wiggsy 

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