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End Of Year Awards
8 January 2021
3.02pm
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Ron Nasty
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News would not stop being posted, @Starr Shine?, as there are obvious stories that will always be posted. There are press releases and big headlines that won’t be ignored. It’s the more obscure stories, or the early hints of news, rumours on respected sites like Steve Hoffman’s Forums, or hints or breaking news that comes via Twitter and other social media sites, that will suffer.

With the easy newspaper stories a link is often all that’s needed… but it’s the coverage of the more obscure stories or early reports of something via Twitter or more obscure sites that take the effort, and I’d certainly be less inclined to hunt out stories were they not appreciated, what others would do would be up to them.

I’d actually argue there’s a stronger argument for merging History with Most Helpful When a Question Is Posed, two categories which often collide.

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The Beatles Bible 2020 non-Canon Poll Part One: 1958-1963 and Part Two: 1964-August 1966

8 January 2021
3.41pm
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meanmistermustard
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Why would you stop posting news if the categories are merged?

"I told you everything I could about me, Told you everything I could" ('Before Believing' - Emmylou Harris)

8 January 2021
3.46pm
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Ron Nasty
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I haven’t said I would, just that less effort would be put into hunting out and commenting on the more obscure were they not seen as a meaningful contribution.

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The Beatles Bible 2020 non-Canon Poll Part One: 1958-1963 and Part Two: 1964-August 1966

8 January 2021
3.47pm
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50yearslate
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Ron Nasty said
I haven’t said I would, just that less effort would be put into hunting out and commenting on the more obscure were they not seen as a meaningful contribution.

  

Whoever said that Beatles news is not a meaningful contribution??

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8 January 2021
3.49pm
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Ron Nasty said
I haven’t said I would, just that less effort would be put into hunting out and commenting on the more obscure were they not seen as a meaningful contribution.

  

Why? And who said they were not seen as a meaningful contribution?

"I told you everything I could about me, Told you everything I could" ('Before Believing' - Emmylou Harris)

8 January 2021
4.28pm
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Ron Nasty
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@50yearslate said
Whoever said that Beatles news is not a meaningful contribution??

@meanmistermustard said
And who said they were not seen as a meaningful contribution?

@AppleScruffJunior said in post 1424 on the previous page
My 2 cents: Is Beatles news even really a justified category? Beatles knowledge 100% is, but is sharing a link and doing a brief summary of news a meaningful category (you can argue this with a lot of the categories but these two seem to be the same ones up for debate)? You could even set up a bot to do it.

Then set up a fecking bot to do it and don’t ask me to bother hunting out things, researching them, and commentating on them. If you think a bot can supply news to the forum, leave it to a bot and don’t complain about me suggesting I’d put less effort in if it was no longer considered as a meaningful contribution. Just means if it still exists next year someone else will win for putting in the effort I’d be less inclined to, or a bot would win and some of you woud know less.

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8 January 2021
5.15pm
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No one is complaining. It’s up you where you spend your time and energy, if you don’t want to post news then fair enough. Same goes for anyone who posts on here, post as often as you want and can. 

I also never asked you to post the stories, I asked why you would stop. You said you would put less effort in. I take it that means you’ll only continue as you are if news and history are kept apart.

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8 January 2021
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Ron Nasty said

@50yearslate said

Whoever said that Beatles news is not a meaningful contribution??

meanmistermustard said

And who said they were not seen as a meaningful contribution?

applescruffjunior said in post 1424 on the previous page

My 2 cents: Is Beatles news even really a justified category? Beatles knowledge 100% is, but is sharing a link and doing a brief summary of news a meaningful category (you can argue this with a lot of the categories but these two seem to be the same ones up for debate)? You could even set up a bot to do it.

Then set up a fecking bot to do it and don’t ask me to bother hunting out things, researching them, and commentating on them. If you think a bot can supply news to the forum, leave it to a bot and don’t complain about me suggesting I’d put less effort in if it was no longer considered as a meaningful contribution. Just means if it still exists next year someone else will win for putting in the effort I’d be less inclined to, or a bot would win and some of you woud know less.

  

If you read her post she clearly said “category” as in “award category,” not “contribution.” I think we can all agree that sharing Beatles news on a Beatles forum absolutely counts as a meaningful contribution. 

And for the record, setting up a bot to sniff out Beatles news sounds like a lot of work for something that would likely be a recipe for disaster.

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8 January 2021
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Ron Nasty
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While @Joe pays little attention to this type of thread, I’m not sure how he would feel about History and News being merged, as he has spent much time encouraging us to be more of a Beatles forum and less of a social forum, but it seems the social are more important to some when it comes to the poll and not it being a Beatles forum.

How about we merge John, Paul, George, Ringo Biggest Fans into one, Most Avid Beatles Fan, after all they’re all kind of similar?

If we work really hard, maybe we can get the poll down to a half-dozen collapsed categories.

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The Beatles Bible 2020 non-Canon Poll Part One: 1958-1963 and Part Two: 1964-August 1966

8 January 2021
7.14pm
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AppleScruffJunior
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I never said posting news wasn’t a meaningful contribution. 

 

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8 January 2021
7.44pm
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Ron Nasty
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AppleScruffJunior said
I never said posting news wasn’t a meaningful contribution. 

Then I would really love to know the difference between a meaningful contribution and a meaningful category.

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8 January 2021
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Ron Nasty said
While joe pays little attention to this type of thread, I’m not sure how he would feel about History and News being merged, as he has spent much time encouraging us to be more of a Beatles forum and less of a social forum, but it seems the social are more important to some when it comes to the poll and not it being a Beatles forum.

How about we merge John, Paul, George, Ringo Biggest Fans into one, Most Avid Beatles Fan, after all they’re all kind of similar?

If we work really hard, maybe we can get the poll down to a half-dozen collapsed categories.

  

I think you are deliberately missing the point. We are trying to have a discussion about making some alterations to a once-annual poll– this response is uncalled for.

I believe Unknown is making a poll, and we can get it sorted then. In the meantime, no more need for threats.

edit: sorry, didn’t mean to quote the @

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8 January 2021
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AppleScruffJunior
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Ron Nasty said

AppleScruffJunior said

I never said posting news wasn’t a meaningful contribution. 

Then I would really love to know the difference between a meaningful contribution and a meaningful category.

  

Everything doesn’t need an award. 

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8 January 2021
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Ron Nasty
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I’m not missing any point, @50yearslate. I am saying that my view is that some people want to make the poll more about social aspects of the forum rather than looking at the Beatles aspects of the forum, that Joe wants the direction to be more Beatles orientated and has closed down much of the social aspect which the poll seems to be drifting toward should History and News be merged, and wondered aloud if Joe would be happy if the categories in the poll stopped reflecting his aims for a Beatles forum, even if the poll is only held once yearly.

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8 January 2021
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Ron Nasty said
I’m not missing any point, @50yearslate. I am saying that my view is that some people want to make the poll more about social aspects of the forum rather than looking at the Beatles aspects of the forum, that Joe wants the direction to be more Beatles orientated and has closed down much of the social aspect which the poll seems to be drifting toward should History and News, and wondered aloud if Joe would be happy if the categories in the poll stopped reflecting his aims for a Beatles forum, even if the poll is only held once yearly.

  

That doesn’t explain your sarcastic comments about the most avid john/paul/george/ringo awards, though.

I understand that we want to focus on the Beatles most of the time because this is a Beatles forum, but I thought the purpose of this poll was to celebrate the users that make the forum so pleasant to be a part of. We spend 364 days a year focused on the Beatles, and the End of Year Awards is a time to acknowledge and appreciate the social aspect of the forum. So many users, myself included, have come for the Beatles and stayed for the Forumpudlians, and I don’t think taking one day to focus on them detracts from the Forum’s Beatleyness in any way. 

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8 January 2021
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Ron Nasty
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And I don’t think it takes too much effort to celebrate those who contribute to the Beatles aspects of the forum, rather than saying the social aspects should be more celebrated. It does detract from this being a Beatles forum, in my opinion, if the two most Beatles categories are merged.

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8 January 2021
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Ron Nasty said
And I don’t think it takes too much effort to celebrate those who contribute to the Beatles aspects of the forum, rather than saying the social aspects should be more celebrated. It does detract from this being a Beatles forum, in my opinion, if the two most Beatles categories are merged.

  

So adding the word “Beatles” to a category makes it inherently Beatley instead of a drain on the forum’s celebration of the Beatles? It’s a one-day event that produces a few virtual badges, I don’t think we’re in danger of sending the forum downhill by consolidating two categories with “Beatles” in their names. I have no problem with appreciating those who uphold the forum’s Beatliness, but we can still do that with one badge instead of two.

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9 January 2021
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Merging the two categories is not the same as saying one or both are not wanted on the forum, not meaningful contributions or valued content. Of course both are and of course the forum is to remain Beatle-focused, I myself have pushed and argued heavily for it at various times as a mod, as have all the other mods. But this is a virtual awards intended to be a bit of fun at the end of the year, to celebrate the contributions and posts made over the year as voted by the users of the forum. Its not and never was a comment on the balance of the forum content or where the forum is heading. As long as I am a mod I will always fight to keep the forum a Beatles-centered forum at all times but this is not what is at stake here.

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9 January 2021
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Little Piggy Dragonguy said
I agree with SS? that a poll is a good idea. So I can put it up tonight or tomorrow morning and we’ll leave it open over the weekend and possibly longer if you guys want. We can’t make polls on the forum, so I’ll do it with Google like the awards were.

 

These are the things we’ll be voting on. If anybody wants to add anything else to it let me know and we can. 

-Merging history and news

-Adding a newbie award (we can talk about wording now or after the poll whichever)

-Re-wording “things that make you go hmmm” to be less ambiguous

-Ron’s idea of thanking nominations in the post thread to narrow down options for the end of the year

 

It’s probably not a good idea for the poll to be anonymous as we had somebody vote under a different username for the end of year awards, so I will do the same thing where you need to put in your username in order to vote. mmm has voiced concerns that if only one person has access to the votes, it’s easy for them to lie about the results. I don’t want that to be a concern, so I was thinking about possibly sharing the results with Holey (or another mod) if that makes people feel more comfortable.

  

@Little Piggy Dragonguy

1. Can you add the ‘awards committee’ option too? 

2. Sharing the results with a Moderator is a good idea. You need somebody impartial.

3. Will anybody get banned from the forum if they disagree with the results?

9 January 2021
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Ron Nasty
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No one will be banned from the forum for having one view or the other, @Tony Japanese. Unless someone descends into personal attacks on other Forumpudlians, starts playing the person rather than the ball, an opinionated conversation conducted reasonably civilly will never see Joe ban someone from the site. While differing opinions are being aired, personal attacks are not being made.

The fallout of this discussion, at its worse, is that some may choose not to participate in the poll at the end of this year because they disagree with changes made.

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