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" Carnival of Light " in the Sgt. Pepper album?
9 April 2017
6.39am
El Submarino Amarillo
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Some people are rumored that the song "Carnival Of Light " will be in the new Sgt. Pepper edition, but it's not named in the tracklist. It supposed to be a hidden track. In my opinion if this rumor it's true it will be amazing. Because it's a song that a lot of fans wanted to hear. So what do you think about this?

9 April 2017
8.56am
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Martha
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Hola Submarino Amarillo,

That would be pretty amazing indeed and I wish these rumours were true and to be honest I also don't think the chance of them being true is that small. The reason for this is that I think Apple would never release CoL independently to not shock anyone and releasing it in the context of the anniversary and also as a hidden track would be a good compromise.

However, I still wouldn't be too confident - maybe the odds are slightly better than they were at other times but it's still not likely.

Not once does the diversity seem forced -- the genius of the record is how the vaudevillian "When I'm 64" seems like a logical extension of "Within You Without You" and how it provides a gateway to the chiming guitars of "Lovely Rita. - Stephen T. Erlewine on Sgt Pepper's

9 April 2017
9.20am
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Starr Shine?
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Wouldn't the Harrison estate block its' inclusion?

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9 April 2017
11.13am
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vonbontee
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Could be. . .but I still wish Paul would just upload it to youtube or wherever anonymously, then he could act all "I'm shocked, shocked" if there was an outcry from the Harrison camp. Paul's the one who really wants the world to hear it anyway 

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9 April 2017
12.47pm
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Joe
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Aside from Penny Lane and Strawberry Fields Forever , they aren't including any non-album songs on the album. That sets a precedent for future album reissues (ie only album tracks and same-period singles, no outtakes), although I don't know if they'll stick to that rule.

It feels doubtful that they'll do another big Sgt Pepper release like this in the foreseeable future, although never say never. Perhaps in 20/25 years. For me, it feels like this is an 'it's now or never' opportunity to put Carnival Of Light out, so it's disappointing that it's not on the tracklisting. Although perhaps it'd be even more disappointing for listeners if it actually was being included. From what I've heard, it's really nothing special.

I wouldn't be surprised at all if it's included somewhere in the package, either as a hidden track on a CD (accessible by rewinding at the start), or as an easter egg on the DVD/Blu-ray. But I'm not sure that Apple is in the habit of doing either of those things.

Also, I'm not sure the Harrison family is really against it still. I know George didn't want it on Anthology 2 (hence the instrumentals of Eleanor Rigby and Within You Without You to make up the time), but that was over 20 years ago and George isn't with us anymore. Situations and attitudes change, and the Harrison estate certainly isn't averse to making other decisions about Beatles and George music. Paul can be pretty persuasive.

It feels like the more this track gets hyped, the harder it is to release it without it being a crashing disappointment. Maybe the best thing the Beatles could do is remix and expand the Anthology albums with extra tracks, and put it on there. Or give us Anthology 4 – the Bottom of the Barrel.

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9 April 2017
1.24pm
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Ron Nasty
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@Joe said
Aside from Penny Lane and Strawberry Fields Forever, they aren't including any non-album songs on the album. That sets a precedent for future album reissues (ie only album tracks and same-period singles, no outtakes), although I don't know if they'll stick to that rule.

I don't think it sets a rule at all. There's an argument not to touch the contents of Pepper beyond involving the two songs it began with.

Most people would be unaware that Northern Song was missing, and the majority of other outtakes from the sessions seem to have been little more than jam sessions.

It leaves them a gap, should they want to use it at a later, to create a set covering the MMT and YS songs, addressing the additional '67 work along with the Lady Madonna  sessions to make that clear split of before and after India.

Compared with the White, which is the next to reach the anniversary, and Get Back /Let It Be , which follows, there is nothing like the amount of unreleased material apart from alternate takes and overdubs.

The next two to reach the anniversary have hours of outtakes and drastically different interpretations rather than slight variations on the theme, and the White has a whole set of proper demos preceding it, while January 1969 has the Nagras - which who knows what they can do with them with the advances in separating the individual elements.

In my view, were they to pursue a similar idea for either the White or GB/LIB , it would be met with howls of derision from fans because we know there is so much more to those sessions than either album, or the tracks on those albums, represent.

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9 April 2017
5.47pm
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Dark Overlord
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It's a shame that Sgt. Pepper is turning 50, especially considering how many people who are still alive can remember it being new, but since it is, I sure hope that they leave disc 1 as the unaltered Sgt. Pepper , in mono and stereo, and have disc 2 as bonus tracks, hopefully Strawberry Fields Forever , Penny Lane , Only A Northern Song , Carnival Of Light , and various jam sessions and alternate versions of songs on the album. I would love to hear the jam session with John on his Strat, although since Good Morning Good Morning has John using a Strat I doubt it would be anything special.

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9 April 2017
6.01pm
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Ron Nasty
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@Dark Overlord said

It's a shame that Sgt. Pepper is turning 50, especially considering how many people who are still alive can remember it being new, but since it is, I sure hope that they leave disc 1 as the unaltered Sgt. Pepper , in mono and stereo, and have disc 2 as bonus tracks, hopefully Strawberry Fields Forever , Penny Lane , Only A Northern Song , Carnival Of Light , and various jam sessions and alternate versions of songs on the album. I would love to hear the jam session with John on his Strat, although since Good Morning Good Morning has John using a Strat I doubt it would be anything special.  

Do you really not read the forum?

We have been speaking of this for days!

The Beatles released this trailer on Wednesday:

Joe put up the tracklisting on both the forum and main site.

Why are you posting what you hope it will be, when we already know exactly what it is?

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9 April 2017
8.26pm
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Dark Overlord
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Now I see, hopefully they put some pictures of George playing Rocky in the booklet, seeing a pre-paintjob Rocky being played during the Sgt. Pepper sessions by George would be even better than Queen making the Australian version of Greatest Hits the canon version.

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10 April 2017
12.06am
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Elementary Penguin
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I know that George vetoed Carnival Of Light 's inclusion on Anthology 2 but that was over twenty years ago and I am sure that Olivia and Dhani would understand that Paul wants to release it and that the die-hard fans want to hear it so I would hope that even though they would be going against George's original wishes that the demand for this particular track is quite high so I would hope that it wasn't the Harrison estate that blocked it's release.

That being said I am not sure how they can release this song in the future unless they release a new Anthology type compilation but I would say the chances of that aren't very high so I would have thought that this would have been the perfect time to finally release this track.

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10 April 2017
3.58am
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meanmistermustard
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If 'CoL' was listed as a track all the talk pre-release would be focused on that ("Unreleased Beatles 'Pepper' recording finally sees the light") and no doubt the reaction after hearing would be pretty negative (considering what people have said having heard it). Apple will want to avoid that and either way, they are going to get complaints (why not?/why bother?) If it is hidden or an Easter Egg then there is less at risk.

I personally doubt we'll see it on here and personally don't care. The session outtakes are enough for me.

Apple are finally opening up the archives again; instead of grumbling about some avant-garde recording not being on here (of which 90% would then grumble about it being on here) let's be happy, say thank you to Apple and then, more importantly, open up our wallets, mortgage our houses, rumble down in the sofa for loose change, and buy the damn thing so Apple see the benefit of further releases. Apple like money lets give them ours.

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10 April 2017
8.12pm
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Elementary Penguin
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Well said. I know that Carnival Of Light will never live up to the expectation that has been built up over all these years but a part of me would like it to be finally see the light of day so we can put it to bed and we can move onto something else from the vaults that needs to be released.

I am excited about the session outtakes though and for me that will be much more exciting and would probably warrant more repeated listens than Carnival Of Light and I hope that this is the beginning of more deluxe editions because I would love to hear some more outtakes from the Rubber Soul and Revolver sessions.

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11 April 2017
4.04pm
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meanmistermustard
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From Wogblog

At a Q&A session, Martin was asked by Paul Sinclair whether "Carnival Of Light was considered for bonus material in the boxed set, to which Martin replied: "Yes, it was. As was 'It’s Only A Northern Song ', as well, actually. But it wasn’t really part of Pepper. It wasn’t part of the Sgt. Pepper recording. It’s a very different thing. I hope we can do something interesting with that at some point…but it wasn’t really part of the Sgt. Pepper album."

Which unless it's some sort of coded cryptic double bluff message where it appears as a surprise inclusion rules out it's inclusion. I get the reasoning behind the logic.

I'll take the last line ("I hope we can...") with as much expectation as a general quote on the 'Let It Be ' movie seeing a release.

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13 April 2017
1.09am
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Duke_of_Kirkcaldy
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meanmistermustard said
From Wogblog

At a Q&A session, Martin was asked by Paul Sinclair whether "Carnival Of Light was considered for bonus material in the boxed set, to which Martin replied: "Yes, it was. As was 'It’s Only A Northern Song ', as well, actually. But it wasn’t really part of Pepper. It wasn’t part of the Sgt. Pepper recording. It’s a very different thing. I hope we can do something interesting with that at some point…but it wasn’t really part of the Sgt. Pepper album."

Which unless it's some sort of coded cryptic double bluff message where it appears as a surprise inclusion rules out it's inclusion. I get the reasoning behind the logic.

I'll take the last line ("I hope we can...") with as much expectation as a general quote on the 'Let It Be ' movie seeing a release.  

WTF... PL and SFF weren't 'really part of the album,' either, but are still being included in this collection.  blue-meanie And come on -- John and George are dead and are thus never going to have any idea COL got an official release. Just give the fans what they want.  a-hard-days-night-paul-11

13 April 2017
1.35am
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Ron Nasty
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No, SFF and PL were the starting point for the album. That they were hived off for a single, and then left off the album because they avoided, where possible, including singles on albums, doesn't change the fact that they were originally intended for the album.

CoL wasn't.

That is the very simple truth of it. It was recorded during the Pepper sessions, but it was never intended for Pepper.

As I've said somewhere above, if this release of Pepper marks the beginning of a new approach to their back catalogue, CoL probably makes more sense on a set that covers the remaining 1967 material through to the Lady Madonna  sessions in 1968.

They identified that line themselves with Anthology 2 .

Giles' statement is just a matter of fact. That doesn't mean it might not feature on some future release of pre-Rishikesh recordings.

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13 April 2017
2.16am
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Duke_of_Kirkcaldy
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I was referring to the complete exclusion of "Only A Northern Song " from this collection in that first statement; I'm well aware COL was never intended for the album.

13 April 2017
2.43am
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meanmistermustard
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I have no idea why 'Only A Northern Song' has been excluded. Maybe we'll get it in a 'Yellow Submarine ' box along with outtakes of 'Sea Of Holes ' and the rest and that's why there is no 'Revolver '.

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13 April 2017
2.44am
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Ron Nasty
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This thread is about Carnival Of Light , and I see no mention of Northern Song in your post that I responded to.

So, apologies if I misunderstood what you were saying, @Duke_of_Kirkcaldy. However, the only songs I see mentioned in your post, are Strawberry FieldsPenny Lane  and Carnival Of Light .

WTF... PL and SFF weren't 'really part of the album,' either, but are still being included in this collection.  blue-meanie And come on -- John and George are dead and are thus never going to have any idea COL got an official release. Just give the fans what they want.  a-hard-days-night-paul-11

I see no mention of Northern Song there. Apologies for getting your comment wrong.

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13 April 2017
3.17am
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Duke_of_Kirkcaldy
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It was supposed to be in reference to this quote (now that I reread it, it appears he's actually talking about COL rather than OANS; sorry for any confusion):

At a Q&A session, Martin was asked by Paul Sinclair whether "Carnival Of Light was considered for bonus material in the boxed set, to which Martin replied: "Yes, it was. As was 'It’s Only A Northern Song', as well, actually. But it wasn’t really part of Pepper. It wasn’t part of the Sgt. Pepper recording. It’s a very different thing. I hope we can do something interesting with that at some point…but it wasn’t really part of the Sgt. Pepper album."

13 April 2017
11.31am
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sir walter raleigh
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I feel after George's passing the Harrison estate will be more passive on blocking these types of releases. Olivia is different from Yoko, where she doesn't feel entitled to Beatles privileges. 

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