Please consider registering
Guest
sp_LogInOut Log In sp_Registration Register
Register | Lost password?
Advanced Search
Forum Scope


Match



Forum Options



Minimum search word length is 3 characters - maximum search word length is 84 characters
sp_Feed sp_TopicIcon
Rubber Soul - rushed?
25 March 2016
9.32am
Avatar
O Boogie
Candlestick Park
Members
Forum Posts: 1352
Member Since:
27 April 2015
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

I was watching a Q & A session with Mark Lewisohn where a fan (was it anyone from here? xP) poses a question about The Beatles taking a long break before the RS sessions, which meant that the album ended up being rushed as they had to get it out before the date that was set for it's release (and they wanted to have it out before that).

Taking long breaks was unusual then. Lewisohn says that he is researching this subject as of now, but as far as he could tell, they had taken holidays, and what's interesting is that he says the days that the Beatles were working are definitely interesting, but so are the days when they weren't. I think there was something happening there..was it a point they were sort of trying to make with the schedules they had to follow? You know, George says in Anthology that he was fed up with the "No, sorry, we can't have that" replies that their requests were met with (he was telling that with regards to Jimmy Nicholls filling in for Ringo, and George didn't really want that).

However, it's interesting how the album would've turned out if it hadn't been rushed. It's a fine album as it is, but do you think perhaps some of he tracks could've been done better if there wasn't the time constraint.

P.S. Lewisohn also says one such long break had been taken even before the Revolver album, but were they faced with any time constraints on that?

 

For tomorrow may rain, so I'll follow the Sun

25 March 2016
9.54am
Avatar
Beatlebug
Find me where ye echo lays
Moderator

Moderators
Forum Posts: 15302
Member Since:
15 February 2015
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

I think it would have been even stronger if they'd had more time to work on it. 

It was certainly rushed; you can tell by their inclusion of reworked old songs like Michelle and What Goes On , and the Help ! reject Wait

As for the production, I can't imagine it being any fabber than it was. a-hard-days-night-george-4The mixing leaves something to be desired, but what's new... ahdn_paul_01

 

If you look at their schedule in those early days, it's insane. How could you seriously expect a band to do two albums a year, a film, and tour? 'Tis absurd; surely something would have to give. But they did it. a-hard-days-night-john-1

The following people thank Beatlebug for this post:

O Boogie, Mademoiselle Kitty >^..^<, pepperland

It verges from the sublime to the ridiculote

Silly-Girl-2016.png Silly-Girl-2017.png bbbadge2018.jpg

New to Forumpool? You can introduce yourself here

25 March 2016
10.17am
Avatar
O Boogie
Candlestick Park
Members
Forum Posts: 1352
Member Since:
27 April 2015
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Yeah, it's insane, but Paul said in an interview where when people asked him how could you put up with that schedule, he said that that was the only way they knew how to do it, they didn't know any other way, and that's what made them what they were.

 

For tomorrow may rain, so I'll follow the Sun

25 March 2016
10.20am
Avatar
Starr Shine?
Waiting in the sky
Apple rooftop
Members
Forum Posts: 15584
Member Since:
1 November 2013
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

I read annother poster point out how the break changed things for them since it opened up their eyes to a different way of doing things.

https://youtu.be/52nwiTs7bk8

Brainwashed by RadiantCowbells.

If you can't log in and can't use the forum go here and someone will help you out.

25 March 2016
10.33am
Avatar
O Boogie
Candlestick Park
Members
Forum Posts: 1352
Member Since:
27 April 2015
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

No wonder some of them were really woeful a-hard-days-night-john-6

Only kidding a-hard-days-night-paul-11

 

For tomorrow may rain, so I'll follow the Sun

25 March 2016
10.38am
Avatar
meanmistermustard
Here when I am. Not when I am not.
Moderator
Members

Reviewers


Moderators
Forum Posts: 22278
Member Since:
1 May 2011
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Interesting that they arrived back in the UK on the 2nd September from the US tour but didnt enter into the recording studios to commence recording what became 'Rubber Soul ' until the 12th October, the album completed under a month later on the 11th November.

Also they had so little to record that a recording session on the 27th October was cancelled

October 27

a.jpg

A recording session booked for this date was cancelled because John and Paul had not yet written sufficient new material.

George Martin: "We hope to resume next week. We are not waxing songs by other composers. We want this to be an all Lennon/McCartney album."

(source: 'The Beatles Diary Volume 1: The Beatles Years')

There's no doubt it was rushed as they also had to start recording well into the night to get tracks finished, something that wasn't the norm at EMI. And I read somewhere recently that the stereo mix was so lousy because George M had to get it done quickly (not that they spent a heck of a lot of time on stereo mixes then anyway).

The following people thank meanmistermustard for this post:

O Boogie, AvecPaix

"I told you everything I could about me, Told you everything I could" ('Before Believing' - Emmylou Harris) 

"Don't make your love suffer insecurities; Trade the baggage of self to set another one free" ('Paper Skin' - Kendall Payne)

25 March 2016
10.43am
Avatar
O Boogie
Candlestick Park
Members
Forum Posts: 1352
Member Since:
27 April 2015
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Could it be that J & P didn't really have enough time to sit by the Kenwood swimming pool because they were busy holidaying? 

 

For tomorrow may rain, so I'll follow the Sun

25 March 2016
10.50am
Avatar
meanmistermustard
Here when I am. Not when I am not.
Moderator
Members

Reviewers


Moderators
Forum Posts: 22278
Member Since:
1 May 2011
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

More than likely they were high.

I like this quote from George, taken from the Rubber Soul section of the 'Anthology' book.

Reefers are hard to avoid in The Beatles' story. All the time, Mal and Neil would sit in Studio No. 2 behind the sound baffles while we were working, rolling them up and smoking. You can hear on one of the tapes from the sessions: a song starts and John goes, 'Hang on, 'ang on...' And Paul starts filling in for him. Then John comes back: 'Ahhhh. OK, OK.' And by the time the engineers have rewound the tape you're thinking, 'I'll just go and have another hit...'

"I told you everything I could about me, Told you everything I could" ('Before Believing' - Emmylou Harris) 

"Don't make your love suffer insecurities; Trade the baggage of self to set another one free" ('Paper Skin' - Kendall Payne)

25 March 2016
10.58am
Avatar
O Boogie
Candlestick Park
Members
Forum Posts: 1352
Member Since:
27 April 2015
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

EDIT:

Did Paul start to take acid by this point? I'm guessing they had the acid experience by this point.

But wasn't reefer a part of their lives since that Dylan meeting? They had it before that, but from then on they had it pretty heavily. If I recall correctly, this was going on during Help ! where they pushed the film director to his limit.

 

For tomorrow may rain, so I'll follow the Sun

25 March 2016
11.07am
Avatar
meanmistermustard
Here when I am. Not when I am not.
Moderator
Members

Reviewers


Moderators
Forum Posts: 22278
Member Since:
1 May 2011
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

LoveUlikeGuitars said
EDIT:

Did Paul start to take acid by this point? I'm guessing they had the acid experience by this point.

But wasn't reefer a part of their lives since that Dylan meeting? They had it before that, but from then on they had it pretty heavily. If I recall correctly, this was going on during Help ! where they pushed the film director to his limit.

Paul first took acid on the 21st March 1967 after taking John home from a 'Getting Better ' recording session. Joe's article on the Beatles and drugs quotes Paul in 'Many Years From Now';

I thought, Maybe this is the moment where I should take a trip with him. It's been coming for a long time. It's often the best way, without thinking about it too much, just slip into it. John's on it already, so I'll sort of catch up. It was my first trip with John, or with any of the guys. We stayed up all night, sat around and hallucinated a lot.

Me and John, we'd known each other for a long time. Along with George and Ringo, we were best mates. And we looked into each other's eyes, the eye contact thing we used to do, which is fairly mind-boggling. You dissolve into each other. But that's what we did, round about that time, that's what we did a lot. And it was amazing. You're looking into each other's eyes and you would want to look away, but you wouldn't, and you could see yourself in the other person. It was a very freaky experience and I was totally blown away.

There's something disturbing about it. You ask yourself, 'How do you come back from it? How do you then lead a normal life after that?' And the answer is, you don't. After that you've got to get trepanned or you've got to meditate for the rest of your life. You've got to make a decision which way you're going to go.

I would walk out into the garden - 'Oh no, I've got to go back in.' It was very tiring, walking made me very tired, wasted me, always wasted me. But 'I've got to do it, for my well-being.' In the meantime John had been sitting around very enigmatically and I had a big vision of him as a king, the absolute Emperor of Eternity. It was a good trip. It was great but I wanted to go to bed after a while.

I'd just had enough after about four or five hours. John was quite amazed that it had struck me in that way. John said, 'Go to bed? You won't sleep!' 'I know that, I've still got to go to bed.' I thought, now that's enough fun and partying, now ... It's like with drink. That's enough. That was a lot of fun, now I gotta go and sleep this off. But of course you don't just sleep off an acid trip so I went to bed and hallucinated a lot in bed. I remember Mal coming up and checking that I was all right. 'Yeah, I think so.' I mean, I could feel every inch of the house, and John seemed like some sort of emperor in control of it all. It was quite strange. Of course he was just sitting there, very inscrutably.

Tho according to Barry Miles that was Paul's second

They knew that the studio roof had just a low parapet and were worried that John might try to fly. Paul and Mal Evans took John back to nearby Cavendish Avenue and Paul decided to keep him company on the trip - Paul's second.

The following people thank meanmistermustard for this post:

O Boogie, AvecPaix

"I told you everything I could about me, Told you everything I could" ('Before Believing' - Emmylou Harris) 

"Don't make your love suffer insecurities; Trade the baggage of self to set another one free" ('Paper Skin' - Kendall Payne)

25 March 2016
1.27pm
The Void
The Jacaranda
Members
Forum Posts: 28
Member Since:
16 March 2016
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

LoveUlikeGuitars said
EDIT:

Did Paul start to take acid by this point? I'm guessing they had the acid experience by this point.

But wasn't reefer a part of their lives since that Dylan meeting? They had it before that, but from then on they had it pretty heavily. If I recall correctly, this was going on during Help ! where they pushed the film director to his limit.

Weed might have been a part of their lives since then but I don't think it really filtered into their songwriting until Rubber Soul .  Although being high all the time probably had a negative affect on the quality of some Help ! songs (the will-this-do lyrics of It's Only Love for instance...)

Having said that, I'm reading Tune In at the moment and it mentions that they had brushes with it as far back as 1960 - it must just not have 'clicked' with them until doing it with Dylan.

Regarding Rubber Soul being rushed I imagine that all their albums before they stopped touring in 1966 were rushed to a certain degree.

"You're not talking to Rikki and the Redstreaks you know!" - John Lennon

28 March 2016
1.21pm
Avatar
Reklo87
London Palladium
Members
Forum Posts: 180
Member Since:
14 March 2016
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

The Void said 

Regarding Rubber Soul being rushed I imagine that all their albums before they stopped touring in 1966 were rushed to a certain degree.

I agree. The Beatles and crew that recorded Rubber Soul were dedicated to recording and making new songs in the studio.  The Beatles were good enough to get what cool ideas they thought of perfected and recording in a timely manner.  The Beatles were also a group to work and work on something until it was perfect. I think, in the end, they all produced a great product that wouldn't be too much different even if they had just another month.  (I don't have the hour total spent on this album to compare to others though.)  If it were in a line graph, at least to me, it fits right in a growth pattern between Help ! and Revolver .

"No Beatles collection is too big or age restricted!"

28 March 2016
1.47pm
Avatar
Beatlebug
Find me where ye echo lays
Moderator

Moderators
Forum Posts: 15302
Member Since:
15 February 2015
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Reklo87 makes a good point. They spent more hours recording this album than they had on any of the others so far-- Little Girl ran away with my CD booklet so I can't say how many, but I do recall it was a record (no pun intended, I swear) for them. 

It verges from the sublime to the ridiculote

Silly-Girl-2016.png Silly-Girl-2017.png bbbadge2018.jpg

New to Forumpool? You can introduce yourself here

28 March 2016
6.20pm
Avatar
Bongo
Somewhere In Time
Candlestick Park
Members
Forum Posts: 1630
Member Since:
28 March 2014
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Correct m if I’m wrong, but I thought they ended up having extra time since a movie deal fell through.  Or was that after Rubber Soul and before Revolver ?????

http://i276.photobucket.com/albums/kk38/rickdelsie/The%20Beatles/parlunread_zps28270d9d.gif BEATLES Music gives me Eargasms!  apple01

28 March 2016
6.44pm
Avatar
Ron Nasty
Apple rooftop
Members

Reviewers
Forum Posts: 9786
Member Since:
17 December 2012
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Brian built time into their schedule for their third film at the beginning of 1966, but no script could be agreed on. This created the long break between the end of the Rubber Soul  sessions and the beginning of the Revolver  sessions, and also allowed them more room to explore in the studio.

Were it to have been the soundtrack to their third film, Revolver  would have been a very different album.

The following people thank Ron Nasty for this post:

Bongo, The Void

"I only said we were bigger than Rod... and now there's all this!" Ron Nasty

 

The Beatles Non-Canon Poll List

16 May 2016
8.25pm
Avatar
Bongo
Somewhere In Time
Candlestick Park
Members
Forum Posts: 1630
Member Since:
28 March 2014
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

If only more time was taken on centering the vocals in the stereo sessions..... a-hard-days-night-ringo-14

The following people thank Bongo for this post:

Beatlebug

http://i276.photobucket.com/albums/kk38/rickdelsie/The%20Beatles/parlunread_zps28270d9d.gif BEATLES Music gives me Eargasms!  apple01

Forum Timezone: America/Chicago
Most Users Ever Online: 700
Currently Online: ThatWeirdBeatlesGirl
1
Guest(s)
Top Posters:
Starr Shine?: 15584
Ron Nasty: 9786
Necko: 7856
50yearslate: 7525
parlance: 7111
mr. Sun king coming together: 6403
AppleScruffJunior: 6374
Mr. Kite: 6147
trcanberra: 6061
mithveaen: 4621
Member Stats:
Guest Posters: 87
Members: 2736
Moderators: 6
Admins: 2
Forum Stats:
Groups: 3
Forums: 44
Topics: 4771
Posts: 328936
Newest Members:
wadawano, Hiram@123, Jimmie K, youknowwhattodo, Oatis Lenndrix
Moderators: Joe: 5061, Zig: 9807, meanmistermustard: 22278, Ahhh Girl: 18414, Beatlebug: 15302, The Hole Got Fixed: 6976
Administrators: Joe: 5061, Ellie: 4