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Paul McCartneys "RAM" vs John Lennons "Imagine"
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Ron Nasty
5560 Posts
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3 September 2013 - 2.57am

a-hard-days-night-ringo-8 As do I, Mind Games is one of my favourite Lennon albums. It's just important to differentiate between an article and review. Both set out to do very different things.

"I only said we were bigger than Rod... and now there's all this!" Ron Nasty

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DrBeatle
Hershey via Boston
1556 Posts
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4 September 2013 - 1.35pm

To answer the original premise of this thread, RAM, and it's not even close. Imagine has some gems on it but a few turds, too. RAM is pure perfection, in my opinion.

"I know you, you know me; one thing I can tell you is you got to be free!"

 

Please Visit My Website, The Rock and Roll Chemist

Twitter: @rocknrollchem

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acmac
229 Posts
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4 September 2013 - 6.08pm

Funny Paper said
Nice review.  

Thank you! :)

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meanmistermustard

19087 Posts
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4 September 2013 - 9.34pm

For me some of the songs on Ram are too long, the screaming ending on Monkberry being one example where I would far rather it had been cut by 2 minutes. Back Seat could also have been ended earlier and it wouldn't have mattered to me (tho many will shriek at such a comment).

 

Eat At Home was a continental single according to wiki and reached #7 in Holland. You learn something every day.

"I told you everything I could about me, Told you everything I could" ('Before Believing' - Emmylou Harris) 

"Don't make your love suffer insecurities; Trade the baggage of "self" to set another one free" ('Paper Skin' - Kendall Payne)

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Hannah
London
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4 September 2013 - 11.31pm

This is incredibly hard as I adore both. I have to be in different moods. If I fancy some rocking, uncomplicated screaming joy I listen to Ram. If I'm feeling reflective or in need of some Lennon truth it's got to be imagine. I'd say Imagine just about wins though. Crippled inside, gimme some truth, jealous guy, all some of my favourite songs. I suppose I have got a bit desensitised to Imagine (song) just because it's played all the time and pushed down our throats a bit. I still love it though and crank up the volume whenever I hear it. 

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trcanberra
Oz
5854 Posts
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5 September 2013 - 1.28am

meanmistermustard said
For me some of the songs on Ram are too long, the screaming ending on Monkberry being one example where I would far rather it had been cut by 2 minutes. Back Seat could also have been ended earlier and it wouldn't have mattered to me (tho many will shriek at such a comment).

 

Eat At Home was a continental single according to wiki and reached #7 in Holland. You learn something every day.

I remember it being played a lot on the radio at the time here in Oz as well and had just assumed it was a single, I was rather surprised to find out it apparently wasn't.

 

==> trcanberra and hongkonglady - Together even when not (engaged for those not in the know!) <==

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Tea and Sympathy
32 Posts
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5 September 2013 - 5.34am

RAM is the superior collection of songs.  Imagine has superior cultural impact.  Both are awesome.

Don't you know? It's gonna be alright. (Shoo-bee-doo-wop)

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parlance
Slaggers
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5 September 2013 - 7.32pm

acmac said

 
Just one more, I think, in case anybody's still reading.
 
 

I definitely read to the end. That was a marvelous review of both albums. Ram is already by favorite Paul album (and Long Haired Lady my favorite song on it) but I'll definitely be listening to it with new ears now.

parlance

Beware of sadness. It can hit you. It can hurt you. Make you sore and what is more, that is not what you are here for. - George

Check out my fan video for Paul's song "Appreciate" at Vimeo or YouTube.

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acmac
229 Posts
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5 September 2013 - 9.29pm

parlance said
I definitely read to the end. That was a marvelous review of both albums. Ram is already by favorite Paul album (and Long Haired Lady my favorite song on it) but I'll definitely be listening to it with new ears now.

parlance

Thank you, that's so nice of you to say. Glad you enjoyed it. :)  

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walrusgumboot
Here, There and Everywhere
78 Posts
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1 October 2013 - 1.51am

RAM was the first solo album I bought, just a wee lad of eleven. Loved it and still do....but I gotta go with Imagine. That's a damned close call though.

....ya won't be interferin' wit the basic rugged concept o' me personality would ya madam?

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walrusgumboot
Here, There and Everywhere
78 Posts
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51
1 October 2013 - 1.57am

Now if it was RAM versus Plastic Ono Band - in my opinion - RAM doesn't even come close to that masterpiece.

Just my thoughts

My thoughts too, man.

....ya won't be interferin' wit the basic rugged concept o' me personality would ya madam?

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likedreamersdo16
A Long and Winding Road
45 Posts
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52
3 October 2013 - 8.58pm

When I was younger (probably 7 or 8) I would always hear RAM and I knew about it even before I really loved the Beatles. I would always be humming Uncle Albert/Admiral Halsey - it was my favorite. I'm not saying that I don't like Imagine, I mean the title track is one of my favorite songs, but I grew up with RAM so it's more of a personal favorite. Actually, only about a year ago my dad told me that RAM was Paul. I had just become a huge fan and I totally flipped. a-hard-days-night-george-10

"Being in the audience actually looks like quite a lot of fun." -Paul McCartney

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WhereArtEsteban
Nashville Tennessee
85 Posts
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4 October 2013 - 8.10am

I really like Crippled Inside ! Hadn't noticed anyone mention it specifically. I George's dobro solo is totally killer and can relate all too well to the message. And How?. man, sometimes I feel I've had enough.

 "Too Many People" is a masterpiece in it's own right and I love good openers and McCartney totally wins for me here.

Imagine I don't think is such a great album opener, but thats just total personal taste. And on the note of that song I've said on here once before but I'll say again, hopefully better: I think people misinterpret Imagine somewhat, especially when they go on about the "no possessions" and the heavy handed idealism. They completely ignore the title, you have to "imagine" the song isn't being written by a pop star on a Rock & Roll (sex,$,drugs,etc) record. I don't think Lennon was that stupid to think people would believe he not only advocated these ideals but also followed them letter by letter. It's an exercise for the mind to think of a world that hadn't at all turned out like the one we live in. and he even calls those people out "I wonder if you can?"- apparently not?

 "Eat At Home" is awesome, whats there really more to say, though?!

I think RAM is probably a more interesting, more fun, therefore entertaining sounding record by far. But Lennon's tunes feel more adjusted personally, especially on my own life.  Though I usually end up skipping I Don't Want To Be A Soldier eventually when it comes on and occasionally I won't listen to It's So Hard

"P. P. P. P. S- L. P. Winner."

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walrusgumboot
Here, There and Everywhere
78 Posts
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54
4 October 2013 - 1.06pm

I just listened to them back to back again this week. Ram seems to get the nod because its more fun, more accessible, not preachy, don't like Phil Spector....I love them both but every single song on Ram is too long, just go on and on and on....Sir George Martin said Imagine was "...pure magic. I'd like to have produced that." I think Ram would have benefited greatly from his overseeing it. PS. I thought Spector was quite restrained on Imagine, nowhere near the overdone Wall of Sound on All Things Must Pass.

....ya won't be interferin' wit the basic rugged concept o' me personality would ya madam?

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fabfouremily
Sitting in an English garden
2929 Posts
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55
4 October 2013 - 4.18pm

Yeah I agree with what you've said there, WhereArtEsteban. I can see that 'Imagine' is probably quite a hard album to listen to for some people, so they might prefer the ''lightness'' of  'Ram'.  See the latter for me is just a little too fun and games. It's a good album, but I prefer the former. I can relate to John in some ways, particularly there, so I guess that helps. It's like listening to your own thoughts sometimes.

Moving along in our God given ways, safety is sat by the fire/Sanctuary from these feverish smiles, left with a mark on the door.

(Passover - I. Curtis)

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DrBeatle
Hershey via Boston
1556 Posts
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4 October 2013 - 4.32pm

Imagine I find to be a vastly overrated album. Some great tunes on there (How Do You Sleep, Crippled Inside, Jealous Guy, Oh My Love), a wildly overrated title track, and some filler that is truly endless (I find it interesting someone above said Ram seemed to go on and on...listen to Gimme Some Truth and I Don't Wanna Be a Soldier and get back to me!). I love John, but to me Ram and Imagine show the differences between John and Paul...once John loses interest in something, which was typically pretty quickly, all effort at improving it goes out the window, whereas Paul is obsessive over every little detail. I love both of them dearly as musicians, but for me, choosing between these 2 albums is no contest...I'll take Ram any day of the week, all 8 of them 8)

"I know you, you know me; one thing I can tell you is you got to be free!"

 

Please Visit My Website, The Rock and Roll Chemist

Twitter: @rocknrollchem

Facebook: rnrchemist

 

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fabfouremily
Sitting in an English garden
2929 Posts
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4 October 2013 - 4.42pm

I get what you mean about the perfection of Ram, but I don't think that's necesarily something to aim for. Don't get me wrong, I love it, but it sounds a bit over-worked to me.

John did have a short attention span, and Imagine is an example of this, but I'd still take it over the other one.

Moving along in our God given ways, safety is sat by the fire/Sanctuary from these feverish smiles, left with a mark on the door.

(Passover - I. Curtis)

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walrusgumboot
Here, There and Everywhere
78 Posts
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58
4 October 2013 - 4.48pm

LOL DrBeatle left myself wide open for that one!

....ya won't be interferin' wit the basic rugged concept o' me personality would ya madam?

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DrBeatle
Hershey via Boston
1556 Posts
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59
4 October 2013 - 5.11pm

walrusgumboot said
LOL DrBeatle left myself wide open for that one!

No worries :D I respect your opinion, and I hope mine didn't come across too harsh...both in print and verbally, I tend to be very opinionated and stubborn in my convictions a-hard-days-night-ringo-13

"I know you, you know me; one thing I can tell you is you got to be free!"

 

Please Visit My Website, The Rock and Roll Chemist

Twitter: @rocknrollchem

Facebook: rnrchemist

 

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Funny Paper
America
2080 Posts
(Offline)
60
4 October 2013 - 6.54pm

It was eleven months ago today,

Funny Paper taught the Bible to play...!

Sorry, got carried away.  I just remembered a topic (An allegory of the Lennon/McCartney symbiosis & synergy) which I put up on November 1, 2012, where I playfully imagined an analogy between Paul and John, and the "two Captain Kirks" from an old Star Trek episode where Captain Kirk gets strangely split apart into two beings -- one that has all his goodness but is wimpy and passive; the other that has all his power and charm, but is rude and aggressive and dark.

The thing about Paul and Ram is that, generally speaking, Paul was always more about the music, and a playful love of music for music's sake; whereas John tended to need to be more "significant" and have "meaning" and tap into emotion more.

Of course, this is a generalization, and one can find glimmers of a playful love of music in John, and of meaning and emotion in Paul -- but I think these overall reflected respective weakness and strengths: which is precisely why they complemented each other and the two of them dovetailed in the Beatles into a symbiotic fusion. 

Paul & John were a Yin/Yang.

Then a Yoko had to come along and ruin it.yoko-ono_01blue-meanie

Faded flowers, wait in a jar, till the evening is complete... complete... complete... complete...

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