The Beatles and the Bible
Charles Manson interpreted that ‘Helter Skelter’ was something to do with the four horsemen of the Apocalypse. I still don’t know what all that stuff is; it’s from the Bible, Revelation – I haven’t read it so I wouldn’t know. But he interpreted the whole thing – that we were the four horsemen, Helter Skelter the song – and arrived at having to go out and kill everyone.
Manson’s theory of Helter Skelter was closely bound to a belief that ‘Revolution 9’ was an aural depiction of chapter nine in the book of Revelation in the Bible. He saw The Beatles as embodying various facets of the book.
And the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth: and to him was given the key of the bottomless pit.
This was variously interpreted by Manson as being about Stuart Sutcliffe, or about Manson himself.
And he opened the bottomless pit; and there arose a smoke out of the pit, as the smoke of a great furnace; and the sun and the air were darkened by reason of the smoke of the pit.And there came out of the smoke locusts upon the earth; and unto them was given power, as the scorpions of the earth have power.
Locusts were taken by Manson to represent The Beatles. The reference to scorpions was deemed a reference to Manson, whose zodiac sign was Scorpio, and the rest of the Family. The bottomless pit was representative of the underground city where the Family was meant to retreat while Helter Skelter took place.
…and their faces were as the faces of men.And they had hair as the hair of women…
Like Charles Manson, The Beatles – particularly John Lennon and George Harrison, had long hair.
And the four angels were loosed, which were prepared for an hour, and a day, and a month, and a year, for to slay the third part of men.
The four angels were The Beatles; the “third part of men”, in Manson’s mind, represented the destruction of white people.
And thus I saw the horses in the vision, and them that sat on them, having breastplates of fire, and of jacinth, and brimstone: and the heads of the horses were as the heads of lions; and out of their mouths issued fire and smoke and brimstone.
Manson thought the ‘breastplates of fire’ were The Beatles’ electric guitars; the ‘fire and smoke and brimstone’ were the lyrics which he thought would initiate the Helter Skelter scenario.
There were numerous other references from Revelation 9 which Manson saw as anticipating the Helter Skelter scenario. However, these are the only ones directly connected, in his eyes, to The Beatles.
It’s The Beatles, the music they’re putting out. They’re talking about war. These kids listen to this music and pick up the message. It’s subliminal.
Let’s face it Charles Manson was evil and wanted revenge and picked the tate house. But I have to say this that I do believe a few of those songs on the White Album were written because of Charles Manson! Why do I believ that? Well Manson knew the Beach Boys and stood out in the crowd because of his weirdness. The Beach Boys probably spoke about Manson and his weird philosiphies and it got back to the Beatles. Also what is too strange is that they called the album the White album and meanwhile Manson hated blacks and wanted a race war. White album stood for the White race. Also Sexie Sadie is too directed to what Susan Atkins was doing. The Beach Boys proably played with her then later bragged to Beatles and music people that they had sexy sadie Susan Atkins. Beatles thought this is weird enough to write about. I don’t believe the Beatles wanted Charles Manson to do killing. I think they juste thought Charles Manson was strange but harmless. Anyway when Charles Manson turned out to be a mass murderer, the Beatles got shaken and tried to bluff their way out of some of those songs. I mean they did not know this horrible murder was going to happen.
Your theory falls down, for a start, with your incorrect assumption that the Beatles called their album, “The Beatles”, the White Album. Your deluded belief is unsupported by any evidence other than your assertion that “The Beach Boys probably spoke about Manson and his weird philosiphies [sic] and it got back to the Beatles”, and further anachronistic, alleged probabilities piled on silly suppositions. “Sexy Sadie” was inspired by Maharishi Mahesh Yogi.
“Album”, by the way, is Latin for “white thing”.
Well said Deadman. Lets put those stupid theories to bed.
The album is not even called The White Album. Its called The Beatles. And which songs are you referring to? Sexy Sadie is about the Maharishi.
Pat, I know this is a very late reply but as others have already said, Sexy Sadie was about the Maharishi. John wrote it & said as much. Sexy Sadie, what have you done? You made a fool of everyone……John got disillusioned with the Maharishi, as did Paul and Ringo. George got sour on him too but George always believed in the philosophy.
And another thing. The Beatles didn’t call the White Album, the white album at first. Everyone else called it that and it stuck.
The only song on the white album that I would like to hear how it came about is “Piggies.” Fit right in with what Manson thought, but the Beatles didn’t have a clue to who Manson was. Some dirty weird hippie guy in California. Young people were very anti-establishment at that time, so “Piggies” was probably just a dig at the establishment. Manson used it all to his advantage. The White Album came out in late 1968. The Manson murders happened in August, 1969.
It’s late, and he can’t refute me, so I’ll say since I first had a copy of “The Beatles,” it was obvious to me that Piggies was inspired by Orwell’s Animal Farm.
honestly i thought it meant that george liked farms.
Your clearly mental, as if the Beatles talked about some random guy out America and then wrote songs about him.
The album is actually called The Beatles but nicknamed the White Album because of the album cover. I doubt they had ever heard of Manson. They certainly would not have written any songs for or about him. They in fact were the opposite of him.
Take 2 or 3 hours, go to YouTube and find longer, full length if possible, interviews of Manson talking, especially parole hearings, and genuinely listen to his logic, philosophy, opinions, and mostly his innocence. The man was framed used and was not a bad person at all. The Manson Trial is still one of the grossest and most inept attempts to find justice ever recorded. It’s a kangaroo court front to back. Sharon Tate and the rest didn’t even actually die, but that’s probably too much too soon for you, but easily verifiable by you right now online. Her dad was named Paul by the way, as is her murdered baby. What a coincidence!!
Did you know the alleged murders took place almost at the exact moment they photographed the cover for Abbey Road? One of the PID clues from that cover is the white VW Beatle above George Harrison with the license LMW 281F, as supposedly Paul would have been 28 IF still alive
(however Paul actually would have been 27, “Faul” or Billy Shears was much older probably 32 or 33 at release, also read 1 as I), while not too exciting really would you like to know what the Manson Family’s Ford Fairline had as a license plate?
LMW 281P.
John Lennon is on record saying while in L.A. one of their acid trips took place at Doris Day’s home. Doris Day is of course the mother of Terry Melcher, the producer Dennis Wilson wanted to record Charlie Manson. In fact that very house was the one rented to Polanski and Tate on Cielo Dr. and was the alleged crime scene.
Blue Jay Way was written by Harrison on Blue Jay Way in Laurel Canyon, CA, a hotbed of 60’s rock and counterculture as well as nefarious, clandestine American intelligence agencies and, well, the aformentioned shennanigans.
That’s some creepy crazy coincidentals concerning the lovable liverpoolian lads for sure. Manson, who spent long time in jail, most his life actually, was released in 67 after what, 10 years in, funded and stocked with drugs, which The La-Biancas, Charles “Tex” Watson, Abigail Folgers, Jay Sebring and Wojtek Frykowski were all heavily involved in dealing as well.
Stinks of shotty FBI, CIA or dimestore plot writing and duplicity. Scripted, acted out, 97 percent of the players are puppets, with a few victims, a few benefactors and one total mind control system in place and operational. Seems even some supernatural wargames are thrown in as needed and this is the 50th anniversary year of many many of the events, bookends of some kind, alternating between beginnings and ends in a retro-casuality synchromistic daydream.
Nonsense.
Lunacy on par with Manson’s, and that, my friend, is saying something.
The White Album was supposed to be named, ” Two Virgins”, and have pictures of naked John Lennon and Yoko Ono on the cover. When the photos were forbidden the name was modified. There’s no need to invent hocus-pocus racist accusations
I totally agree. Charles Manson was an evil but highly intelligent psychopath, but I also believe the Beatles wrote some of their songs based on his philosophies and weirdness. I wouldn’t be surprised to find out that they had met Manson in person. I also believe that he ordered the murder of those people at the beach near Santa Barbara in 1970 while he was behind bars. So today, I’m glad he’s dead. He can cause no more trouble, or influence any more young people into believing his rhetoric.
This is a silly silly thought. People to this day read of past living and deceased serial killers; obsessed with their rhetoric if you will and carry out because they believe in the individual in their philosophies.
I agree he was very intelligent he might of been crazy but he knew how to get into peoples heads and control them with drugs such as acid. if you listen to these songs that Charles did you can see where he might of been coming from. im studying Manson and what he and the family did honestly i see him as a genius he never killed anyone but yet took the chargers his hands were clean he was only but the leader in these cases. there are still many bodies that could be related to manson such as the Reet girl who they have only recently ID. think about how many more there could be.
Pat,
The White Album was call “The Beatles”. And John song “Sexy Sadie” was written in response to the Maharishi Mahesh Yogi’s alleged sexual advance on actress Mia Farrow. “Sexy Sadie” was not directed to what Susan Atkins was doing.
Manson was one disturbed creature. Could you blame him for ending up like that though? Had a pretty rough life. Not defending him, or making excuses for him – because a lot of people have tough childhoods and don’t become murdering monsters. Just saying if your mom sold you to a pedophile for a glass of beer, how would you turn out?
His mother drank alcohol during pregnancy so he was screwed from birth.
To the above comments that the theory that charles manson sick theories were spoken and the Beach Boys heard it is not impossible. First of all the Beach Boys were working with Manson. Charles was strange. The Beach boys spoke alot with the Beatles and Charles Manson stood out. Why couldn’t a few of those songs in the White Album be about Charles? He was an odd character and stood out. Songwriters write about other people. So it makes sense. I don’t believe they directed Charles to kill no but it seems too much of a coincidence when I listen to the album.
Charles Manson and Dennis Wilson were acquaintances. The rest of the band thought Manson was crazy.
It’s a leap in logic to say that they were “working together”.
Not true, Manson recorded in Brian Wilson’s home studio. Love also has written about knowing him. Neil Young was also friendly with Manson. Manson was very well connected and well known in the LA scene.
Charles Manson received a visit from one George E. Shibley in March 1967 at his parole. Shibley was a very prominent Beverly Hills lawyer, with rich clientele, and some oil companies as clients. At this time, Manson was in for 10 years on forgery and parole offences. He wanted to stay in jail. One has to ask, why is a petty crook, mainly in for Dyer Act convictions, one count of prostitution, getting visits from a Beverly Hills lawyer.
2 years later that same lawyer is representing Sirhan Sirhan, the assassin who did not assassinate RFK. When the Manson Murder trials began, Shibley was on board as “an old friend of Charlie”.
It’s also funny how Sexy Sadie Susan Atkins was offered $150,000 to turn state’s evidence and say it was all done for Charlie.
Never mind Terry Melcher, Derek Taylor and all that. Or Melcher and McCartney being on the board of directors of Monterey Pop. Or the Esalen Institute, where Manson and Family played 3 days before the murders, which should be called the Watson Murders.
There’s a lot to that man and how he got to where he got, that you probably DON’T want to know, and how The Beatles played a part in it, knowingly or unknowingly, is anyone’s guess. C I A, you know, those guys who experimented with LSD before anyone ever heard of it in Haight Ashbury. You might want to ask them. Or how Polanski miraculously avoided prison when sodomising and drugging an underage girl.
You just don’t want to know.
Go on then, tell us.
Manson isn’t the only nutcase on display here…..
Black men being deprived of white women would go out & commit violent acts? Where did this come from? I don’t remember reading that in Vincent Bugliosi’s book…
Apparently it’s in there. Can anyone confirm?
The following passages are from the “Helter Skelter” chapter headed “February 1970.” In the book’s “25th Anniversary Edition,” published by Norton in 1994, they’re on pages 245 and 247:
“[Family member Paul] Watkins [to prosecutor Vincent Bulgiosi]: ‘[Charlie] used to explain how [Helter Skelter] would be so simple to start out. A couple of black people—some of the spades from Watts—would come up into the Bel Air and Beverly Hills district … into the rich piggy district … and just really wipe some people out, just cutting bodies up and smearing blood and writing things on the wall in blood … all kinds of super-atrocious crimes that would really make the white man mad …
…
“One day at the Gresham Street house, while they were on an acid trip, Manson had reiterated to Watkins and the others that blackie had no smarts, ‘that the only thing blackie knows is what whitey has told him or shown him’ and ‘so someone is going to have to show him how to do it.’
“I [Vincent Bugliosi] asked Watkins: ‘How to do what?’
“ANSWER: ‘How to bring down Helter Skelter. How to do all these things.’
“Watkins: ‘Charlie said the only reason [Helter Skelter] hadn’t come down already was because whitey was feeding his young daughters to the black man in Haight-Ashbury, and he said that if his music came out, and all of the beautiful people—‘love’ he called it—left Haight-Ashbury, blackie would turn to Bel Air to get his rocks off.
“Blackie had been temporarily ‘pacified’ by the young white girls, Manson claimed. But when he took away the pacifier—when his album came out and all the young loves followed Pied Piper Charlie to the desert—blackie would need another means of getting his frustrations out and he would then turn to the establishment.”
If the following link holds up, you’ll be able to read the passages directly, at Google Books: https://books.google.com/books?id=cwf7fqxjRigC&pg=PA328&lpg=PA328&dq=%22He+used+to+explain+how+it+would+be+so+simple+to+start+out%22&source=bl&ots=y4CrMQHOxo&sig=4R0zGyZ0ck2pST9B8ymutycPwkQ&hl=en&sa=X&ei=ekcgVdPnO8SDsAXK3YHYCQ&ved=0CB4Q6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=%22He%20used%20to%20explain%20how%20it%20would%20be%20so%20simple%20to%20start%20out%22&f=false
Frankly, this article about Manson should be removed. It’s rather garish seeing his face (and story) on page 1 of a nice Beatles site, and in no way deserving of debate all these years later. The Beatles were so popular and influential that millions were deeply affected by it, enough to play albums backwards to reveal ‘hidden messages’, even play the record covers, analyze lyrics, emulate their hair, clothes, and Lennon’s glasses, as well as popularizing Indian classical music (sitar), including a little known religion (Hinduism), the idyllic self-search called meditation, even helped advance electronic technology considering their endless studio work. Manson was just one of these millions. His story is fascinating, but does not belong on a Beatles website.
This is part of the Beatles story. Maybe you would like to santise everything and censor what you dont like but this is what happened like it or not.
My sentiments exactly. I posted a similar comment, though more agressive in attacking the lack of critical thinking here. THERE IS NO CONNECTION between any song by the Beatles and these murders.
Yes, the best approach is either to remove this or add that the Beatles songs can’t be associated with the delusions of a murderer. Failing that, yes, remove it.
The story is here because, through no fault of their own, it IS a part of the Beatles’ story.
They themselves are highly quoted about Manson. If you don’t like reading about it, then don’t. Free choice, you see.
Helter skelter is a fucking kids carnival ride. Notbing more notbing less.read tbe lyrics you ignorant fucks
Well there are supposed to be hidden messages hidden in songs,ant The Beatles songs are what you make of them,thats pretty much the magic of them,because they are kinda weird i guess…idk my opinion…
joe – That’s the point of all this. The meanings of the songs are what the individual make of them. And that can range from the most lovely and benign to the most hateful and violent.
It’s no different than varying interpretations of politics and religion….they can be used to justify anything the individual interpreter wishes good, bad, or in-between.
Its actually about an up and down relationship with the carnival ride being a metaphor.
You’re right in a way, but totally wrong in another way – “Helter Skelter” is indeed a kid’s carnival ride but the Beatles reinvented the phrase. They turned the phrase into a monumentally powerful heavy metal record that can blow susceptible minds apart. It’s THAT that influenced the wacko Manson.
Charles Manson was a failure as a musician.
In fact, he was a failure at everything.
He was a drug crazed psycho who killed others because he could not be like them.
George Vreeland Hill
What is the source of the “November 25” date for the Beatles door?
There is testimony from one of the trials, claiming that specific people connected to Manson had an “advance copy of Abbey Road.” However this is not verifiable.
I believe that’s from Helter Skelter: The True Story of the Manson Murders by Vincent Bugliosi and Curt Gentry.
The following passage is from the “Helter Skelter” chapter headed “May 1970.” In the book’s “25th Anniversary Edition,” published by Norton in 1994, it’s on page 294:
“On May 25 [1970], I was going through LAPD’s tubs on the LaBianca case when I noticed, standing against the wall, a wooden door. On it was a multicolored mural; the lines from a nursery rhyme, ‘1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7—All Good Children Go to Heaven’; and, in large letters, the words ‘HELTER SKELTER IS COMING DOWN FAST.’
“Stunned, I asked [LAPD Sgt. Manuel] Gutierrez, ‘Where in the hell did you get that?’
“‘Spahn Ranch.’
“‘When?’
“He checked the yellow property envelope affixed to the door.
“‘November 25, 1969.’
“‘You mean for five months, while I’ve been desperately trying to link the killers with Helter Skelter, you’ve had this door, with those very words on it, the same bloody words that were found at the LaBianca residence?’
“Gutierrez admitted they had. The door, it turned out, had been found on a cabinet in Juan Flynn’s trailer. It had been considered so unimportant that to date no one had even bothered to book it into evidence.
“Gutierrez did so the next day.”
If the following link holds up, you’ll be able to read the passage directly, at Google Books: https://books.google.com/books?id=Fiyw_LeL51MC&pg=PA390&lpg=PA390&dq=%22On+May+25,+I+was+going+through+LAPD%27s+tubs%22&source=bl&ots=yM7yLr8TN0&sig=ZmE-xhu0lMSYrYgyIkAsd7iZo0E&hl=en&sa=X&ei=gGsgVazSHcGKsAWpiYK4Cg&ved=0CB4Q6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=%22On%20May%2025%2C%20I%20was%20going%20through%20LAPD's%20tubs%22&f=false
The statement that the Manson Family was able to listen to “an advance copy” of “Abbey Road” is from the Ed Sanders book “The Family.” In the edition published by Thunder’s Mouth Press in 2002, it’s on page 288 and reads as follows:
“Around October 1, Vance, Vern, Zero and Diane came to the Goler Wash camp, bringing with them an advance copy of the new Beatles album, ‘Abbey Road,’ which was played on a battery-operated machine.”
I don’t know what significance the commenter above places on any supposed “unverifiability” of that statement. As a little bit of Googling will show, “Abbey Road” had already been released in England by that October 1 and was released in the U.S. on that date. The album’s hit single, “Something,” was released in the U.S. in October’s first week. Members of the Manson Family, in other words, even if they hadn’t had access to “an advance copy,” had had plenty of time to hear that very-successful album before late November 1969, when that door was confiscated at Spahn Ranch.
PS In “Helter Skelter,” prosecutor Bugliosi does not indicate whether he ever attempted to find out who put the writings on that door, and he does not seem to have attached any significance to the “1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7—All Good Children Go to Heaven.” (In the book’s chapter headed “October 6-31, 1970,” he reports that the door was part of the prosecution case, at trial, but he refers to it only as “the ‘Helter Skelter’ door.”) One has to wonder how the presence of that rhyme on “Abbey Road” struck Manson and the Family members who knew of the Family’s involvement in the Tate-LaBianca murders, whose victims had totaled seven.
Well researched! I was also troubled by that 1234567 reference and until fairly recently had left it unresearched. But the current brand of PID (Paul Is Dead) freakery which is basically an adaptation of ‘The Illuminatus Trilogy’ with Paul McCartney as Yog Soggoth was playing this up so I reproduced the research you’ve just quoted and in addition found that many radio stations airing sides of the album in its entirety at the time. So no problem getting that earworm and translating it into…erm…a door scrawled on in blood.
Thanks, I’m glad you appreciate the research. Having been a teenager when Abbey Road was released, I can tell you that, yes, a local “underground” radio station played the album in its entirety just before or just after it was released here, in the Philadelphia area. This might have been after “Something” was already being played on at least one of the Top 40 stations. (There was some sort of pre-release release of “Something” on a station here, I think–some such unusual thing.) When I look back on those days, I’m struck by the awe, the reverence, with which a new Beatle album was regarded. Obviously, the reaction of Manson and his followers was idiosyncratic, to put it mildly; but in a way, it wasn’t unusual.
Sorry, John, but Revolution 9 was a MAJOR part of Manson’s whacky beliefs. So “they had nothing to do with me” falls a little short.
Charles Manson was a frustrated musician with some talent. He had enough talent that both Dennis Wilson and Neil Young advocated that he be signed to a record contract. This is important. If he would have been a completely talentless hack, he would have never had hope. He had hope and it was dashed over and over again. He blamed, among others, Terry Melcher (the Beach Boys producer and son of Doris Day) for his inability to seal the deal. Terry Melcher was the previous occupant to Roman Polanski and Sharon Tate at the Cielo Drive residence. Manson actually visited the place himself and talked to Tate, who told Manson that Melcher didn’t live there anymore. Still, Manson came away from the encounter that the house was an embodiment of the “establishment” and thought of it when he put out his order. He also hoped it would send Terry Melcher a message. The motivation of the “Helter Skelter” as Manson saw it may, or may not, have worked on his disciples, but I don’t believe for a second that Manson himself ever believed any of it – he just used it to manipulate some troubled runaways that would do anything for him.
Man Son – is there something in that, conspiracy freaks ?
Yes but you need to read the Bugliosi book (which isn’t a conspiracy book unless it’s part of the conspiracy but I’m not unless I secretly unwittingly am). Don’t wanna give spoilers.
..and let’s not forget Lennon’s frankly strange admission in the RS interview 1974, where he confessed to taking acid in 1966 at “Doris days house or wherever it was we used to stay”
.. The Beatles and Manson were both part of related intelligence operations, seriously odd that he would divulge this information
..cognitive dissonance ?
Doris Day, her son Terry Melcher, Charles Manson, john Lennon,Donald Trump, Alex Jones, Bannon…oh man what a great conspiracy theory somebody could weave if they had a free weekend!
Don’t encourage them, Robert!
I don’t like the pseudo-objective style of this article at all. If it’s about a murderer and about crime it has nothing to do with the Beatles. You are wrong to indulge in the murderer’s fantasies. You are delusional yourself in that case. Is the song good? You don’t even care! No critical analysis is offered. You are just involved in libel and slander. Do you even care? Once again, THERE IS NO CONNECTION between any song by the Beatles and these murders. You are pathetic and the comments here are even worse. Do we blame Beethoven for Napoléon? Is Mozart to be judged because someone died during “Figaro” because it took too long? Frankly I’m pleased you can read and write… but you clearly have no powers of critical thinking.
Part of critical thinking is the ability to understand the point a piece of writing is making. For instance, being able to tell the difference between describing a person’s beliefs and promoting those beliefs.
I think it’s pretty clear from a critical reading that the point of the article is NOT to hold the Beatles or any of their songs responsible for the actions of a murderer.
Get over yourself, Jeffery. This article tells a story, one of some historical significance and certainly a part of the Beatles’ history. It exists.
You self-important, sanctimonious, shallow-thinking people (I’ll be kind here) are quite problematic and somewhat scary in your own right.
As Ringo said, thank God they caught the bugger. Mind you it took them a bit longer to catch Polanski.
The Who’s Pete Townshend wrote “I can see for miles” Was considered a pretty heavy metal tune for the time. McCartney had wrote Helter Skelter as an answer to top that tune. (Anthology DVD, McCartney)
Yep it’s a slide ride for fun for the most part. The Beatles did write their songs about places, and events around them.
Maybe Bugliosi did reach when using in his prosecution a race war and his evidence was a mis-spelled
“Healter Skelter”.
The Beatles would not have been mentioned at all if these words were not written in victim’s blood.
Manson was a failed musician/car thief. Dennis Wilson, Terry Melcher were probably just being kind, but saw no real talent in the small man.
It’s even been said that the Tate/Labianca murders were a drug deal gone bad.
The Beatles are nowhere to blame.
Ice T”s rap stuff “Cop Killer” from the 90’s is far more suggestive. A lot more media released thus far in the 21st century, do make the Beatles closer to Jesus teachings, then much of the crap today 🙂
Peace everyone!
One unfortunate side effect of all this is that many people of my age who remember when this happened (it was very big news back then) were actually turned off of the “White Album” due to the creepy connotations, here in the US, anyway.