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Who was the beatles best guitarist?
29 August 2012
9.33pm
Long John Silver
Hollywood Bowl
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TBH, I don't really see why Michele gets so much air play, there are a lot better McCartney/Beatles songs out there which deserve more air play.

Living is easy with eyes closed, misunderstanding all you see.
29 August 2012
9.34pm
mr. Sun king coming together
Nowhere Land
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You made a specific claim – Yesterday and Michelle are the two most played songs. Walrus used a metric which completely dismantled your statement. You explained your claim, and reiterated it. You were again wrong, and I pointed it out with evidence.
That's what has happened since this has been revived (not counting your helping Kedame).
My point about popularity: You (being the big Paul fan you are) have stated many times Paul's solo career is better then it is publicly viewed to be. Correct? Indeed it is. You are saying popularity doesnt equal quality. And yet here, you try to create a correlation between popularity and quality. Hypocritical? Yes.

Also, you ignored the part about George playing the guitar solo on Michelle. He does.
Edit: I see you did talk about Michelle after I started typing. Ignore my last point.

I tried to think of something powerful and moving… and failed.  "You were given a choice between war and dishonor - you chose dishonor, and you shall have war" - Winston Churchill
29 August 2012
9.36pm
paulsbass
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Long John Silver said
TBH, I don't really see why Michele gets so much air play, there are a lot better McCartney/Beatles songs out there which deserve more air play.

Well, when I play live in front of a cafe and do Michelle, most of the people of any age begin to smile and start humming and nodding their head…

Is "I am the walrus" are more innovative song? Yes of course!

But I imagine I might get a little frowned upon when playing THAT…

 

It's just a nice, beautiful song with a certain atmosphere.

Paul McCartney himself said he was astounded by the success, since it was so easily arranged and recorded…

Check out the rest of the list:

Mostly love songs, touching stuff, acoustic, natural stuff.

29 August 2012
9.37pm
Von Bontee
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I don't understand why something as nebulous as "most played" means a damn thing to anybody anyways. What does the number of plays matter if the number of listeners is unknown? How do ensure that those who listened, LIKED what they listened to? Meaningless, unverifiable data.

  You won't see me nowhere, man, I'm looking through you!
29 August 2012
9.41pm
paulsbass
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Von Bontee said
I don't understand why something as nebulous as "most played" means a damn thing to anybody anyways. What does the number of plays matter if the number of listeners is unknown? How do ensure that those who listened, LIKED what they listened to? Meaningless, unverifiable data.

As I said:

I play a LOT of these songs from the list.

Why?

Because ALL THE PEOPLE love them, although, surely, the older ones love them more.

A song like "Wonderful world" (both of them!) is just timeless.

These are songs most people like to listen to when they want to feel good.

Trust me, I experience this VERY often!

 

There are more interesting songs out there, sure.

But I get EVERY crowd with "Stand by me" and will continue to do so many more years, hopefully.

29 August 2012
9.46pm
Von Bontee
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I wasn't referring to your long list at all!

Lot of great songs in that list, definitely. The fact that they make a lot of people happy is entirely irrelevent to their greatness, however.

  You won't see me nowhere, man, I'm looking through you!
29 August 2012
9.51pm
paulsbass
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mr. Sun king coming together said
You made a specific claim – Yesterday and Michelle are the two most played songs. Walrus used a metric which completely dismantled your statement. You explained your claim, and reiterated it. You were again wrong, and I pointed it out with evidence.

Walrus called that claim "obviously wrong" and said it was something like 43rd. He was referring to a very selective group of people.

I proved my point by showing a list of UNIVERSAL radio plays, so my position was totally understandable and correct. I was very obviously NOT "obviously wrong".

You came up with a list of unknown identity that "proves" Michelle is not the 2nd, but the (close) 3rd most often played Beatles song. So – IF this list is more accurate – I was a LITTLE wrong – guilty because of lack of information – but not THAT "obviously wrong".

Would you care to get that, please?!

That's what has happened since this has been revived (not counting your helping Kedame).
My point about popularity: You (being the big Paul fan you are) have stated many times Paul's solo career is better then it is publicly viewed to be. Correct? Indeed it is. You are saying popularity doesnt equal quality. And yet here, you try to create a correlation between popularity and quality. Hypocritical? Yes.

Didn't I say I don't want to know about what you are trying to say here? I still don't get it and I still don't want to know! You claim and blame quite freely here and I'm not going to join in.

Also, you ignored the part about George playing the guitar solo on Michelle. He does.
Edit: I see you did talk about Michelle after I started typing. Ignore my last point.

A little apology (not about the overlooking but about the rating of the guitar playing in Michelle) would have been nice, but I can live without it…

29 August 2012
9.52pm
paulsbass
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Von Bontee said
I wasn't referring to your long list at all!

Lot of great songs in that list, definitely. The fact that they make a lot of people happy is entirely irrelevent to their greatness, however.

I can just guess that you are very wrong here.

29 August 2012
9.53pm
Long John Silver
Hollywood Bowl
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paulsbass said

Long John Silver said
TBH, I don't really see why Michele gets so much air play, there are a lot better McCartney/Beatles songs out there which deserve more air play.

Well, when I play live in front of a cafe and do Michelle, most of the people of any age begin to smile and start humming and nodding their head…

Is "I am the walrus" are more innovative song? Yes of course!

But I imagine I might get a little frowned upon when playing THAT…

 

It's just a nice, beautiful song with a certain atmosphere.

Paul McCartney himself said he was astounded by the success, since it was so easily arranged and recorded…

Check out the rest of the list:

Mostly love songs, touching stuff, acoustic, natural stuff.

It is a great song, like most Beatles song, just some songs don't get enough attention. I wasn't really thinking of I am the Walrus, but rather Mother Nature Son, Strawberry Fields Forever, Norwegian Wood, I've Just Seen a Face etc…

Living is easy with eyes closed, misunderstanding all you see.
29 August 2012
9.56pm
paulsbass
Candlestick Park
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Long John Silver said

It is a great song, like most Beatles song, just some songs don't get enough attention. I wasn't really thinking of I am the Walrus, but rather Mother Nature Son, Strawberry Fields Forever, Norwegian Wood, I've Just Seen a Face etc…

I'm totally with you there!

Mother nature's son will be in any of my top ten lists. I still don't play it in the streets – I make more money with Michelle!

Norwegian wood and I've just seen a face get almost always great response from the audiences in pubs.

Why?

Wait for it:

Because they are not as overplayed as Michelle!!

 

"Isn't it ironic…"

 

Trying to stay-on-topic I'd like to remind you how we came here:

I was trying to prove my point about Paul's guitar playing output and influence in the Beatles being not "minimal", since he is featured on "the" two most often played Beatles songs.

I wasn't trying to tell everyone that these are the two best Beatle songs, they're just among the most popular and best known.

29 August 2012
10.01pm
Long John Silver
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Yeah, and they have a great acoustic sound (well they are recorded on acoustic guitar after all xD) and they are great for playing. 

 

I think this was first time we agreed on this forum, strange feeling haha.

Living is easy with eyes closed, misunderstanding all you see.
29 August 2012
10.01pm
minime
Candlestick Park
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I just don't get what this conversation about which Beatles song is the most played has to do with topic, Who was the Beatles' best guitar player, that is. Besides, are the most played Beatles songs popular because of the guitar playing? Hardly. Come on, it might be the case ( and probably is) with Jimi Hendrix, but the Beatles just isn't particularly known for its guitar playing, not that the general public ever particularly plays attention to guitar when they hear a top charted song!

29 August 2012
10.08pm
Von Bontee
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Von Bontee said I wasn't referring to your long list at all!Lot of great songs in that list, definitely. The fact that they make a lot of people happy is entirely irrelevent to their greatness, however.

I can just guess that you are very wrong here.

Uh, no I am not. Choose whatever current hit song you hate the most – or your most hated hit song from any given year, for that matter – and tell me what makes it great.

  You won't see me nowhere, man, I'm looking through you!
29 August 2012
10.10pm
paulsbass
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minime said
I just don't get what this conversation about which Beatles song is the most played has to do with topic, Who was the Beatles' best guitar player, that is. Besides, are the most played Beatles songs popular because of the guitar playing? Hardly. Come on, it might be the case ( and probably is) with Jimi Hendrix, but the Beatles just isn't particularly known for its guitar playing, not that the general public ever particularly plays attention to guitar when they hear a top charted song!

Please check posting Nr. 89.

 

And I find it really hard to disagree that Paul's acoustic guitar is not essential in both songs!

Sure, the lyrics and his fantastic vocals and the strings play their part as well, but still.

I'm sure to this day these songs (and many others by the Beatles) inspire people to start learning how to play the guitar.

 

There are innumerable pop- and rockstars who started their career because of the Beatles – and of course their guitar playing was always essential.

Rockband equals guitar.

29 August 2012
10.12pm
paulsbass
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Von Bontee said

Uh, no I am not. Choose whatever current hit song you hate the most – or your most hated hit song from any given year, for that matter – and tell me what makes it great.

 

This is totally OT and belongs into a thread "what makes a song great" – I think we already have one of those!

Let's meet there and talk this over another day, ok?

Fascinating topic.

29 August 2012
10.14pm
meanmistermustard
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And i thought the arguing had been left in the 'never to be mentioned ever again' thread.

 

Of all people John made a comment about Yesterday and its popularity in restuarants and such places. From the playboy interviews

I'm always proud and pleased when people do my songs. It gives me pleasure that they even attempt them, because a lot of my songs aren't that doable. I go to restaurants and the groups always play "Yesterday." I even signed a guy's violin in Spain after he played us "Yesterday." He couldn't understand that I didn't write the song. But I guess he couldn't have gone from table to table playing "I am the Walrus."

Gotta love that man.

"Well, probably we'll sell less records, less people'll go to see the film, we'll write less songs, and we'll all die of failure" (John Lennon 8/64)
29 August 2012
10.20pm
Von Bontee
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Paulsbass, there is NOTHING to talk over regarding this!

Just because a song is popular does NOT make it great!

Period!

!

  You won't see me nowhere, man, I'm looking through you!
29 August 2012
10.23pm
mr. Sun king coming together
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Von Bontee said

Paulsbass, there is NOTHING to talk over regarding this!

Just because a song is popular does NOT make it great!

Period!

!

Thank you! I tried saying that, but he refuses to accept it.

I tried to think of something powerful and moving… and failed.  "You were given a choice between war and dishonor - you chose dishonor, and you shall have war" - Winston Churchill
29 August 2012
10.42pm
Von Bontee
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Well, surely the two of us together will be enough to change his opinion!

Next topic: Who was the Beatles' best drummer?

  You won't see me nowhere, man, I'm looking through you!
29 August 2012
10.47pm
mr. Sun king coming together
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Obviously that was George. No argument, really.

I tried to think of something powerful and moving… and failed.  "You were given a choice between war and dishonor - you chose dishonor, and you shall have war" - Winston Churchill
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