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Who wrote what songs?

1 November 2012
2.15pm

Funny Paper

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Rishikesh

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Is there a definitive list out there of all Beatles songs and their "true" author?

More importantly, how do we know whether such a list is accurate? Is there a scholarly article published in a peer-reviewed journal(The International Journal for the Study of Beatlenomics) that lays out all the verification with references?

I found one list that claims to apportion out each song -- whether the main author was Lennon, or McCartney (or Ringo or Harrison):

http://www.myrsten.nu/worldnet…..esongs.htm

-- but the guy who put the list together doesn't cite his source. I emailed him, and he said he got it from Ian MacDonald's book A Revolution in the Head. But if so, how did MacDonald ascertain who really wrote what song?

I know this site here, the Beatles Bible, lists actual author for each song -- but where did they get that info?

Mundo paparazzi mi amore cicce verdi parasol.

1 November 2012
3.44pm

meanmistermustard

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Generally the information comes from interviews given by John, Paul, George and Ringo over the years. Both John and Paul have openly discussed who wrote what and how much in tons of interviews from the time the song came out right thru the solo years; for example John went thru a lot of the songs in an interview with Playboy in September 1980 and Paul spoke about many tracks in the book 'Many Years From Now'.
Some books give percentages (John .75 Paul .25 for example) but some of that is presumption and for a handful of tracks there is a dispute about who wrote what due to differing accounts from both – but nothing is trully simple in beatleworld.

"Well, probably we'll sell less records, less people'll go to see the film, we'll write less songs, and we'll all die of failure" (John Lennon 8/64)

1 November 2012
7.06pm

paulsbass

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In general you can trust the rule:

Lead singer = main writer

There are very few exceptions, one supposedly being the high middle part in A hard day's night, written by Lennon but sung by McCartney.

This list looks mostly allright, but there are some obvious flaws:

There's a place – NOT Lennon but co-written and co lead vocals L/M

Every little thing – NOT "unclear" but co-written and co-lead vocals (verses in unisono, chorus two part harmonies)

it's No Reply and NOT No Replay

Eight day's a week – main writer NOT McCartney but co-written

Drive my car – lead singer is NOT McCartney/Lennon but just McCartney

it's If I needed someone NOT If I need someone

The word – Lead singer NOT Lennon/McCartney but just Lennon

Thank you girl – lead singer NOT Lennon but Lennon/McCartney

if you give Yes it is to Lennon as a lead singer, you have to do the same with This boy

Apart from that an ok list, but of course it get's lot easier up from Revolver with the definition of main writer and lead singer.

1 November 2012
8.47pm

meanmistermustard

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Isnt Drive My Car Lennon and McCartney together singing the lead? Thats what Lewisohn and other sources have.

"Well, probably we'll sell less records, less people'll go to see the film, we'll write less songs, and we'll all die of failure" (John Lennon 8/64)

1 November 2012
10.48pm

Funny Paper

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Rishikesh

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meanmistermustard said
Isnt Drive My Car Lennon and McCartney together singing the lead? Thats what Lewisohn and other sources have.

Just have a listen to the song. The poster "paulsbass" is correct -- Paul is singing the lead; however, it does sound like John chimes in to sing at least backup with Paul in the chorus part (and the "beep-beep, beep-beep, YEAH!"), and I could swear it's John singing that one little line -- "and baby I love you"..

Mundo paparazzi mi amore cicce verdi parasol.

2 November 2012
2.48pm

frankdialogue

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Yes, generally lead singer either wrote most of, or is main inspiration for song.

'Yes It Is' & 'This Boy' mostly Lennon, but with Paul adding finishing touches, clean up man if you will.

Song like 'Wait' is McCartney, but Lennon still adds important vocals.

In early days, Lennon have a little stronger voice, and some would say a more distinctive voice…But also realize that Lennon's vocal mike always turned up higher.

2 November 2012
3.43pm

Joe

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Funny Paper said

I know this site here, the Beatles Bible, lists actual author for each song -- but where did they get that info?

From hundreds of books, interviews, videos and other sources I've accumulated over the past 20 years.

Please don't spoil my day; I'm miles away

2 November 2012
4.23pm

Von Bontee

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I'm with meanmm – I think that "Drive My Car" is best described as a shared lead vocal. Paul's higher voice cuts through the mix a little more, but he and John are still singing the same words (except when John screws up that one line near the end!)

Anyways, yeah; there's abundant documentation out there as to who wrote what. "In My Life" and maybe "Eleanor Rigby" are really the only disputed tracks.

You won't see me nowhere, man, I'm looking through you!

2 November 2012
5.36pm

paulsbass

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Von Bontee said
I'm with meanmm – I think that "Drive My Car" is best described as a shared lead vocal. Paul's higher voice cuts through the mix a little more, but he and John are still singing the same words (except when John screws up that one line near the end!)

Funny Paper nailed it:

Just have a listen to the song.

This is Macca's song, and of course there is a second vocal, but in this case it really IS a SECOND vocal and not a co-lead.

In the chorus all three join in, but McCartney is still the dominant voice, apart from some "and baby I love you" where John is more audible.

2 November 2012
7.09pm

meanmistermustard

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Drive My Car – Paul or John?

Anyone got any cyanide?

"Well, probably we'll sell less records, less people'll go to see the film, we'll write less songs, and we'll all die of failure" (John Lennon 8/64)

2 November 2012
7.39pm

paulsbass

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meanmistermustard said
Drive My Car – Paul or John?

Anyone got any cyanide?

LOL!

As in "A day in the life" I will never understand how anyone could even consider this a non-McCartney lead vocal…

So it's all not a big deal for me.

If you want to know the answer, listen to the record.

2 November 2012
8.40pm

Von Bontee

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OK, so it's just a matter of how you define "lead". To my way of thinking, the fact that J & P are singing the verses together makes them co-lead singers – even though Paul's voice is more prominent.

I've listened to the record many times, thanks!

You won't see me nowhere, man, I'm looking through you!

2 November 2012
9.25pm

robert

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paulsbass said

Von Bontee said
I'm with meanmm – I think that "Drive My Car" is best described as a shared lead vocal. Paul's higher voice cuts through the mix a little more, but he and John are still singing the same words (except when John screws up that one line near the end!)

Funny Paper nailed it:

Just have a listen to the song.

This is Macca's song, and of course there is a second vocal, but in this case it really IS a SECOND vocal and not a co-lead.

In the chorus all three join in, but McCartney is still the dominant voice, apart from some "and baby I love you" where John is more audible.

I think Paulbass has it right. McCartney does the lead vocal in Drive My Car. I think you can figure it out this way – first based on the chord structure, Paul's vocal is the actual melody – John is doing a harmony – Paul notes are the ones that go with the chord structure. The more practical method is that when you sing the song by yourself, you sing Paul's part. Your ear can tell.

"She looks more like him than I do."

2 November 2012
9.27pm

robert

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To add wood the fire, it's the same in If I Fell – although there's 3 part harmony John is doing the main melody. Same with This Boy – John's part is the actual melody.

"She looks more like him than I do."

2 November 2012
9.38pm

paulsbass

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robert said

I think Paulbass has it right. McCartney does the lead vocal in Drive My Car. I think you can figure it out this way – first based on the chord structure, Paul's vocal is the actual melody – John is doing a harmony – Paul notes are the ones that go with the chord structure. The more practical method is that when you sing the song by yourself, you sing Paul's part. Your ear can tell.

I figure it out this way:

Paul's voice is not just the loudest and clearest, it's also the only one you can identify with no mistake.

I couldn't say if the second vocal was Paul duetting with himself or John without any doubt.

But it's very clear that the lead is Paul.

2 November 2012
9.40pm

paulsbass

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robert said
To add wood the fire, it's the same in If I Fell – although there's 3 part harmony John is doing the main melody. Same with This Boy – John's part is the actual melody.

Well, in these two songs (This boy and Yes it is) for me it's a three part harmony in the verses, and I have a hard time saying which one is the actual melody, but in the middle eights it's just John (with some Aaahs from George and Paul), so there's no mistake.

If I fell: Lead vocal John with a very strong second vocal by Paul (so it's actually a two part harmony). the fact that the second vocal is so strong is prove for me that Paul had a lot to do with the writing/composing.

2 November 2012
9.53pm

Von Bontee

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OK, I understand your point (and Robert's) & won't argue about it. I just wanted to make sure you weren't claiming that Paul double-tracked his voice so he could sing harmony with himself!

I accept your interpretation of "lead".

You won't see me nowhere, man, I'm looking through you!

3 November 2012
6.09am

Funny Paper

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Rishikesh

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If I may -- I will delineate the vocals in "Drive My Car" (and will also thusly "indicate precisely what I mean to say"):

Asked a girl what she wanted to be
She said baby, "Can't you see
I wanna be famous, a star on the screen

[both Paul and John are singing, but Paul's voice cuts through louder and higher and with that recognizable inimitable McCartney je ne sais quoi tonality to his voice, while John is doing some very interesting lower-part harmony, but definitely subtle, not dominant]

But you can do something in between
[here both voices mingle more closely and it's difficult to distinguish Paul]

Baby you can drive my car
Yes I'm gonna be a star
Baby you can drive my car

[Here the voices of Paul, John and George are all blended together such that no individual is distinct (which is the very definition of a good 3-part harmony)]

And maybe I love you
[Here, John's voice seems dominant]

I told a girl that my prospects were good
And she said baby, "It's understood
Working for peanuts is all very fine

[cf. above]

But I can show you a better time

[cf. above]

[etc.]

Beep beep'm beep beep yeah!
[another fine blending of all three voices]

[And so forth. Also, note that in the later lines --]

I told that girl I can start right away
And she said, "Listen baby I got something to say:
I got no car and it's breaking my heart…"

[Paul's distinction of voice is even more recognizable.]

[The parts where Paul's voice pierces through may be said to be analogous to those 2-part vocals of the Stones in which both Jagger and Keith Richards are singing, and if one listens one can detect the tell-tale sound of Richards, but it's clear that it's being "driven" by Jagger, so to speak]

Mundo paparazzi mi amore cicce verdi parasol.

3 November 2012
6.16am

Funny Paper

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Rishikesh

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Joe said

Funny Paper said

I know this site here, the Beatles Bible, lists actual author for each song -- but where did they get that info?

From hundreds of books, interviews, videos and other sources I've accumulated over the past 20 years.

Thanks Joe!

Mundo paparazzi mi amore cicce verdi parasol.

3 November 2012
12.40pm

gotagoodreason

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Funny Paper said
If I may -- I will delineate the vocals in "Drive My Car":

(…)

But you can do something in between
[here both voices mingle more closely and it's difficult to distinguish Paul]

(…)

And maybe I love you
[Here, John's voice seems dominant]

[etc.]

You're absolutely right, except for these 2 lines :

- the first is sung by 3 voices (notes : C-F(lead)-G), Paul probably singing the highest note of this terrific harmony (the close second between F and G is what makes it so terrific) ;

- the line 'And maybe I'll love you' is definitely sung by Paul and George, no matter what the experts say here about John singing it, again the ear can tell !

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