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Did Yoko love John?
22 December 2013
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WETSRoosa
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parlance said
I just came across this 60 Minutes feature on Cynthia and Yoko, with an appearance by a 12-year-old Sean. I couldn't think of anywhere else to post it.

When did Yoko start wearing sunglasses, btw? I read that she claimed she wears them because John said he liked her with them, so she's never goes out without them. I wonder when she decided to start that tradition.

 

 

parlance

I heard the same thing that John liked how they looked on her so as a tribute to him she wears them. Sean even once joked that if his friends see her without the shades, they get confused looks on their faces. The first time she wore them on an album cover was '82's It's Alright (I See Rainbows).

"There's no such thing as bad student... only bad teacher."
22 December 2013
7.37pm
meanmistermustard
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I've always thought the "two of us. . . " verses were about Paul and Linda whereas "You and i have memories. . ." relate to John and Paul, tho "chasing paper, getting nowhere" is more a reference to the financial problems J & P had with Apple.

Don’t make your love suffer insecurities, trade the baggage of self to set another one free. ('Paper Skin' - Kendall Payne)
22 December 2013
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WETSRoosa
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meanmistermustard said
I've always thought the "two of us. . . " verses were about Paul and Linda whereas "You and i have memories. . ." relate to John and Paul, tho "chasing paper, getting nowhere" is more a reference to the financial problems J & P had with Apple.

I've always heard/read that "Two of Us" was about Paul & Linda only, though I've never believed that totally. Maybe on the surface it is, but there's no way "You and I have memories..." can be about anyone other than John. Paul and Linda weren't together long enough at that time (middle of White Album is when they started dating seriously, around autumn of '68 right?) to warrant that kind of lyric.

"There's no such thing as bad student... only bad teacher."
23 December 2013
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fabfouremily
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I agree that the line 'you and I have memories...' seems more appropriate in regard to John, but I've never heard Paul say it was about anyone but him and Linda, so maybe he's not actaully aware of it himself? Maybe he wrote it about him and John, or parts of it, but he never realised it on a conscious level.

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''We're just knocked out. We heard about the sell out. You gotta get an album out, you owe it to the people. We're so happy we can hardly count.''

23 December 2013
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fabfouremily said
I agree that the line 'you and I have memories...' seems more appropriate in regard to John, but I've never heard Paul say it was about anyone but him and Linda, so maybe he's not actaully aware of it himself? Maybe he wrote it about him and John, or parts of it, but he never realised it on a conscious level.

 

That's my line of thinking. And this song is the oddity because this is one of the few cases where Paul hasn't (and maybe won't) admit to what that song is all about. Usually he's pretty forthcoming about the topic of his songs-"Got To Get You Into My Life" is about pot, and Paul has always said that up front- but "Two of Us" is one of his very few exceptions.

"There's no such thing as bad student... only bad teacher."
23 December 2013
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fabfouremily
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^ True, though I can't recall anyone actually asking him. Or at least not in recent years, I'm not entirely sure about interviews going back to the time. Maybe because people just assume? He did say something once, actaully, about him and Linda just taking off in their car and so he wrote 'TOU'. I can't remember if that was an interview or what though, for some reason I think it wasn't.... Damn, I really wish my memory was better...

''We're just knocked out. We heard about the sell out. You gotta get an album out, you owe it to the people. We're so happy we can hardly count.''

24 December 2013
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Why can't some enterprising interviewer comb through The Beatles Bible and ask Paul, (while he's still with us) for a straight answer to the questions we keep deliberating about? 

3 February 2014
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parlance
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Didn't know where else to put this, but someone posted this link elsewhere - it's an interview with Reggie King in which he mentions his part in bringing John and Yoko together:

You knew Yoko Ono early as well, is that right?
Yeah, I met Yoko at the Middle Earth in Covent Garden. She said “Reggie, you look very much like John Lennon” – which a few people had said before because I guess I do look a bit like him. “I’d really like to meet John” she said. As we had the same producer as The Beatles she wouldn’t leave me alone. It wasn’t me she wanted, it was John. So I said, “Look, if it helps, John does occasionally go to The Speakeasy. I see him there sometimes on a Tuesday night.” The very next Tuesday she was there. Before, she’d had all the flower dresses on, the psychedelic outfit, but in The Speakeasy she had the West End girl look. All smooth and smart. That night Paul and John came in. Paul said hello. And John used to say to me (adopts heavy scouse accent) “Aye, ye Action Man!” That was all he ever used to say, but he spoke to me at least! Yoko stood there dumbfounded, “Wow, you really do know The Beatles.” Within fifteen minutes she was in there and the rest is history.

parlance

Beware of sadness. It can hit you. It can hurt you. Make you sore and what is more, that is not what you are here for. - George

Check out my fan video for Paul's song "Appreciate" at YouTube and Vimeo.

3 February 2014
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It would really make my day if one day an interviewer would sit with Yoko and ask her about all these wild claims of the johnandyoko romance that are so easy to disprove. It will never happen tho.

Don’t make your love suffer insecurities, trade the baggage of self to set another one free. ('Paper Skin' - Kendall Payne)
3 February 2014
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meanmistermustard said
It would really make my day if one day an interviewer would sit with Yoko and ask her about all these wild claims of the johnandyoko romance that are so easy to disprove. It will never happen tho.

 

I'm not sure how "these wild claims" would be "so easy to disprove" for nobody would probably believe what she says anyway, people have their minds made up about Yoko by now and I don't think that there's really anything that she could say to change much of that.  I'm sure that anyone who interviews her nowadays is given a "do not ask" list before commencement of any Q&A session...:-)

3 February 2014
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^^ Well, more likely is that they're given a few cards with questions on from their superiors, or they just read off the little telly screen thing if it's a tv programme.

''We're just knocked out. We heard about the sell out. You gotta get an album out, you owe it to the people. We're so happy we can hardly count.''

3 February 2014
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Sadly thats how most interviews seem to be done noways with celebs. The PR person comes in and informs the interviewer what can be asked and what cannot and then stand close by monitoring events to ensure it all goes accordingly. Go off script and they will either butt in and remind the interviewer of the script or even pull the whole thing.

Don’t make your love suffer insecurities, trade the baggage of self to set another one free. ('Paper Skin' - Kendall Payne)
3 February 2014
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Yeah shes basically used him and his legacy to launch her celebrity profile. Apparently she was planning to divorce him then he decided to release an album.Saw another opportunity. He wanted it to be a solo album, she forced herself on and even made him alternate songs because she knew no one would listen to hers on one side. Jack Douglass had to hold separate sessions most of the time with only one present because they couldnt be in studio together. So I look at Johns final album as a combination of DF and Milk and Honey. Would of been possibly his best. John definitely loved her, must of to put up with that. But I dont know if she did during the recording of DF. 

Also regarding facebook post Yoko is saying that because she didnt treat John good. Well thats the image I get from mutiple insider books. Charlie Swann tarot advisor AKA John Green has a book about his experiences. So does Fred Seamans their personal assistant. 

 

 

 

 

 

5 February 2014
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kezron9 said
Yeah shes basically used him and his legacy to launch her celebrity profile. ...
Also regarding facebook post Yoko is saying that because she didnt treat John good. Well thats the image I get from mutiple insider books. Charlie Swann tarot advisor AKA John Green has a book about his experiences. So does Fred Seamans their personal assistant. 
 
 
 
 
 

Yeah, because they're so reliable. Those of you who want to believe the worst about Yoko or John & Yoko really amaze me sometimes with the trash you'll believe. Paul himself brought John and Yoko back together, so he must have believed she loved him. But all of you know better because John Green and Fred Seaman said differently... And you think Yoko was the one who used him for her own benefit??

5 February 2014
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Musketeer Gripweed (kezron9)
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Lennonista said

kezron9 said Yeah shes basically used him and his legacy to launch her celebrity profile. ...
Also regarding facebook post Yoko is saying that because she didnt treat John good. Well thats the image I get from mutiple insider books. Charlie Swann tarot advisor AKA John Green has a book about his experiences. So does Fred Seamans their personal assistant. 
 
 
 
   

Yeah, because they're so reliable. Those of you who want to believe the worst about Yoko or John & Yoko really amaze me sometimes with the trash you'll believe. Paul himself brought John and Yoko back together, so he must have believed she loved him. But all of you know better because John Green and Fred Seaman said differently... And you think Yoko was the one who used him for her own benefit??

That was in '74 alot can happen between then and 1980....Plus Paul did that most likely to try and mend there friendship. Listen to his demos and output during that period. He doesnt sound too happy. Just like starting over, he wanted to start over why? Things werent right. I said I believe John loved her, but I cannot say the same about Yoko. Also I'm Losing You...Johns music has always been truthful. So with what he is saying and insiders accounts, thats enough to cast doubt in my mind. Also she knew who he was before they met. She even admitted to using him for the peace movement. But before you trash a source, have you actually read any of those books? Heard what Jack Douglas has said about those sessions?

5 February 2014
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Lennonista
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kezron9 said

Listen to his demos and output during that period. He doesnt sound too happy. 

He doesn't sound unhappy to me. In fact, his Dakota stuff doesn't sound much different than his private tapes and demos from the Kenwood/Beatle days. John was never Mr. Sunshine, let's not forget.

And yes, I've read those books, including that scumbag AG's magnum opus de garbage

I just don't get why some are hell-bent on asserting that "things weren't right" (your words). How could you possibly know what was actually going on in the Dakota? You don't. And I don't claim to, either... but I can tell you there's no way in hell I'm going to trust opportunists of questionable character (not to mention questionable motive) who jumped on the post-1980 cash wagon.

5 February 2014
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Even if John or Yoko did mull over the idea of divorce, we can't say for sure that means they didn't love each other, or what they were thinking privately, or what they said to each other in private.  No one can say what would have happened if John had lived.  I think the way Yoko talks about John and remembers John shows that she loved him.  Was it a perfect relationship?  I don't think so.  But I don't think any of John's relationships could have been perfect.

"This Beatles talk bores me to death." --John Lennon

5 February 2014
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One thing that nobody can really refute is the fact that John & Yoko's marriage survived much adversity over the years which further strengthened the undeniable bond between them, even if the claims of them going through a rough time in John's last years are in fact true, I would think that it would've been more likely that they'd moved past it and become even closer as a result.  Reading into John singing about "starting over" because of some desire to make a clean break from Yoko, or a "divorce", is nonsense.  He says "when I see you darling, it's like we BOTH are falling in love again, it'll be just like starting over"...:-) 

5 February 2014
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Expert Textpert said
Even if John or Yoko did mull over the idea of divorce, we can't say for sure that means they didn't love each other, or what they were thinking privately, or what they said to each other in private.  No one can say what would have happened if John had lived.  I think the way Yoko talks about John and remembers John shows that she loved him.  Was it a perfect relationship?  I don't think so.  But I don't think any of John's relationships could have been perfect.

Exactly! And I hasten to add that people must be careful of the sources that they base their opinions on.

5 February 2014
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Musketeer Gripweed (kezron9)
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Billy Rhythm said
One thing that nobody can really refute is the fact that John & Yoko's marriage survived much adversity over the years which further strengthened the undeniable bond between them, even if the claims of them going through a rough time in John's last years are in fact true, I would think that it would've been more likely that they'd moved past it and become even closer as a result.  Reading into John singing about "starting over" because of some desire to make a clean break from Yoko, or a "divorce", is nonsense.  He says "when I see you darling, it's like we BOTH are falling in love again, it'll be just like starting over"...:-) 

You have totally twisted my words. I was saying he wanted to start over with her...But why start over? because they didn't have a great relationship. I wasn't referring to him leaving her, but many sources claim she was going to leave him but then he decided to launch a comeback. Also the Lost weekend, apparently both had ongoing affairs. This website mentions Yoko was also dating some guitarist during the lost weekend, which I was surprised I hadn't heard. Apparently he never stops seeing May. The BOTH line cant be used to support her loving him.Written by John its what he wanted and hoped for in my opinion.John knew how to manipulate the media which they both did.  I look at Johns I'm Losing You  followed by Yoko's I'm Moving On as some sort of supporting evidence. Also my friend knows Fred Seaman he's a good guy his account is very accurate. My friend never new he even worked for John. The book was also published in 1992 so he didn't hop on the 80's bandwagon. He was crushed when he was killed. I am and never said she didn't love him she did, but there is enough evidence to cast doubt in my mind if to question if she did in 1980.

 

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