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Could George have suffered from Post Traumatic Stress Disorder from Beatlemania?
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28 June 2012
11.32pm
Ben Ramon
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I've heard all sorts of things about George and John's "fist fight": that it occurred because Yoko stole a digestive biscuit from George, because George started telling John how Dylan thought Yoko was uncool, and various other things. John claimed physical blows weren't traded in a later interview but I guess we'll never know what really went down.

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29 June 2012
5.32pm
robert
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Apparently the problem between George and Yoko during Let It Be sessions is that Yoko sat on George's amp. To anyone who plays even semi-professionally, you know this is a no-no - you just don't sit on someone else's amp. If screws up the settings and blocks the sound and it's just not done.

The best synthesis of the info is that John and George had a shoving match which was physical but not throwing any punches.

This is when George walked out and John made his comment about getting Eric Clapton to talk George's place.

I think John's comment (the swagger as a defense) shows the problem in that moment was between George and him.

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29 June 2012
9.30pm
meanmistermustard
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From what i can gleem from what Doug Sulpy wrote, transcribed from the Get Back tapes, is that there was no fist fight. Suply writes that Michael Housego wrote an article in a newspaper called the 'The Daily Sketch' on 20th January and on the 21st January, when George had returned and they were now at Apple "George mentions the part of the article that reports he and John "threw a few vicious phrases" at one another - which he [George] claims is untrue, and Yoko chimes in that thats libel". (The Complete Get Back Sessions, page 96)

Wasnt the biggest problem in January 1969 that John wouldnt communicate with anyone, most of the time during discussions about the band or the Get Back project John would sit there and say nothing. Also relations between all 4 were lousy (George wasnt happy with being in the band and how he was treated by John and Paul), the environment sucked (both in the studios during recording the White Album and when in Twickenham rehearsing in January 1969), Paul was overbearing, and Yoko was there 24/7.

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1 July 2012
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kelicopter
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The Walrus said 
It is true that not all Aspies present all symptoms (as I said), and there are some who have no quirks in their speech and very good motor control (often this is trained though). One example is Owl City, who I will link to at the bottom. However, George barely presented any of the symptoms.

Wow, never knew Owl City has Asperger's.

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13 July 2012
11.24am
Stephanie
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Ever just think he might have been really sad, depressed? If something that has been apart of your life for so long ends, even if you wanted it to, I can't imagine that is easy, and some people handle it better than others. I would be pretty upset for a while too, I'm not good with change, maybe George wasn't either. 

13 July 2012
5.22pm
fabfouremily
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Stephanie said
Ever just think he might have been really sad, depressed? If something that has been apart of your life for so long ends, even if you wanted it to, I can't imagine that is easy, and some people handle it better than others. I would be pretty upset for a while too, I'm not good with change, maybe George wasn't either. 

True, true. I think that sometimes it's easy to gather some info, make up another part and say that that person was ill or suffered with some kind of illness.

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13 July 2012
7.16pm
Stephanie
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fabfouremily said

Stephanie said
Ever just think he might have been really sad, depressed? If something that has been apart of your life for so long ends, even if you wanted it to, I can't imagine that is easy, and some people handle it better than others. I would be pretty upset for a while too, I'm not good with change, maybe George wasn't either. 

True, true. I think that sometimes it's easy to gather some info, make up another part and say that that person was ill or suffered with some kind of illness.

Yeah I agree, sometimes we want to figure out reasons behind everything that happens so we seem kind of in more control over how it  could have happened. I just don't think it's as "dramatic" or as severe as we seem to think sometimes. 

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10 February 2014
3.24am
tulane
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Being that famous and under all that pressure virtually non stop for years on end is not a normal situation and I don't believe that anyone could behave normally all the time under those circumstances.  There would have to be moments where anyone would crack and go off on one.

10 February 2014
8.25pm
Billy Rhythm
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minime said

The Walrus said

unknown said
I think that George might have had a very small case of Asbergers. This would explain why he got so angry during that period: he was overwhelmed by always being surrounded by so many people, and he expressed that through anger. That would also explain his obsession with India because that is sometimes a side effect of Asbergers

Though maybe I'm just over thinking all of this.a-hard-days-night-george-10

Okay, firstly it is Asperger's, not Asbergers. If you struggle to spell, use the abbreviation AS.

Secondly, there aren't "small cases". People display different symptoms, people learn different coping strategies, and people learn at different rates (be they NT or Aspie), but nobody has a "small case", not to the extent of only displaying symptoms on a few occasions in their lives.

George was introverted, but he seemed perfectly capable in social situations, he didn't seem at all distressed by being in sensory cauldrons like Shea (only made weary by constant touring and fame), his speech was neither overly formal nor pedantic, he had no trouble understanding nuanced speech, he did not seem to have issues with mind blindness. Furthermore, people with AS tend to be rather clumsy and struggle with fine motor control; they also commonly speak with a boring, blunted tone and little use of intonation or inflection. George Harrison was a world class guitarist, and not only a capable singer, but one who had a successful career and sang on more than one #1 hit.

Now, I don't think either that George has AS, I find it pretty ridiculous to think so, but I don't totally agree with the way you back up your claims.

Asperger's belongs to same "group" of syndroms as autism, but that doesn't necessarily mean all the symptoms are same or presented. There are a lot of people with AS who don't have any problems with motoristic skills, and are able to speak normally. As it happens, I know such a person ( not to say that all of them are the same, though).

What you didn't mention is that people with AS often have a burning passion for a very specific subject, and if you strecth the truth a little bit, you could claim that George's Indianism was a sign of that. I don't buy it.

 

Neither do I believe that any of the members had PTSD. a-hard-days-night-ringo-13

 

Asperger's Syndrome is greatly misunderstood, and those who have people close to them with the diagnosis know what I'm speaking of.  Although it's classified as a "disability", it's far from being one.  These individuals' ability to function "normally" are only hindered by the state that the world is around them which places heavy emphasis on social behaviour, which is a lifetime struggle for them due to the framework and pace that their minds process thought at, which is much more advanced than that of the average human.  The Syndrome is named after Hans Asperger who doctored the first intense research on these special minds in the 1940s and is exactly the same diagnosis as High Functioning Autism which is much different than the other forms found on the Autistic Spectrum, for example, speech impairment is virtually non-existent to a person diagnosed with Asperger's and they in fact often excel with a clear (and loud!) speaking voice, unlike other Autistic persons.

 

While I'd agree that George seems an unlikely candidate for Asperger's, John on the other hand appears to display many tendencies that those with Asperger's have.  It's also misunderstood that these persons are "hermits" or avoid social contact which also isn't really the case for many of them.  Sure, they'll avoid these situations when they can for their anxiety level raises considerably around others, but many learn to cope with crowds by putting on a social front with dramatic results such as John often appeared to be doing.  John Lennon, in fact, has been mentioned in more than a few papers citing examples of persons who possibly had Asperger's, which wasn't even being given official diagnosis to anyone in the country that I live in (Canada) until the mid 1990's, people like Mozart, Einstein and even Bill Gates are frequently noted as well, not just because of their social behaviour but because of their brilliant minds.  Persons with Asperger's speak and do things as they think instead of thinking beforehand, which often gets them into uncomfortable situations for those around them, does this not sound a bit like John?  Certainly not George, who always appeared to think clearly before speaking.

 

Asperger's persons are of an extreme nature, whether it's anti-social or overtly flamboyant, they think in Black & White, or very logical thought which accounts for the advanced mathematics skills but struggles to grasp the English Language which is anything but logical.  John kind of made the language more logical for himself with his wordplay by changing things around to suit his thought processes, which on the outside to a trained scholar would appear goobledegook for not abiding by the rules.  Pay close attention to the bit on the 'Anthology' next time where George discusses John's discomfort with disabled persons and shows shots of John mocking them to relieve his anxieties, that's very Asperger's when it comes to self-regulation strategies in social situations.  John is not only a strong candidate for the Syndrome, but a likely one in my opinion, if he didn't have the creative outlet to vent as he did with music it would've probably been even more apparent than it was...:-)   

10 February 2014
8.36pm
fabfouremily
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It's been discussed on here and ''out there'' that John may have had Asperger's. I certainly think it possible as, like you say, he does seem to have some of the symptoms or personality traits of a sufferer. We'll never know, though.

Moving along in our God given ways, safety is sat by the fire/Sanctuary from these feverish smiles, left with a mark on the door.

(Passover - I. Curtis)

13 April 2014
1.53pm
stuartgardner
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The instant I read your post's title I flashed on George saying in Anthology, "The fans gave their money and their screams, but the Beatles gave their nervous systems."  

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26 June 2015
11.15am
Annie Music
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I think George might have got a bit of things from Autism.

I have it myself and I notice when there is a lot of stress coming around me I can react angry and moody and like George did in the end of the tours. Also obsessions with little things or in this case "India" is a tiny thing of Autism. also when unexpected things happen people with autism can go 'crazy' or stressed or angry and everything like that.

I'm not sure if George has Autism and I really don't want to say "He got it" but I think he might have some points that can be connected to it. a-hard-days-night-george-4

26 June 2015
4.50pm
JPM-Fangirl
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I'm not so sure George had any form of autism. I do know he was an introvert. I'm the same personality type he was, and I can tell you this: I need to have time to myself! I can be social, I can do the whole crowd thing, and what have you. But the energy I have for those things is very limited and I have to be alone to recharge. When I am forced to stay in social situations too long, I get cranky, impatient, nervous, anxious, sometimes even violent. 

Since the lads had to be "on" all the time when touring, never really a moment to themselves, it's no wonder George became touchy. Even in their hotel rooms, there was always another Beatle around. I can't begin to imagine how mentally drained he must have been! It's no wonder he embraced the eastern spirituality with that much zeal: it was the perfect way for him to shut himself off from the world and really be alone. It probably gave him a lot of energy and peace.

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26 June 2015
8.37pm
Silly Girl
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^Same here. 

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26 June 2015
8.52pm
Annadog40
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In order for George to have PTSD, he would have to hit the qualifications for each disorder

For PTSD he would have to (info place)

  • Experienced a traumatic event
  • Witnessed, in person, a traumatic event
  • He learned someone close to him experienced or was threatened by a traumatic event
  • He was repeatedly exposed to graphic details of traumatic events (for example, if you are a first responder to the scene of traumatic events)

After the traumatic event George would then have to

  • Relive experiences of the traumatic event, such as having distressing images and memories.
  • Have upsetting dreams about the traumatic event.
  • Experience flashbacks as if you were experiencing the traumatic event again.
  • Experience ongoing or severe emotional distress or physical symptoms if something reminds him of the traumatic event.

Could Beatlemania be considered a traumatic event?

A definition of traumatic event is

A traumatic event is an experience that causes physical, emotional, psychological distress, or harm. It is an event that is perceived and experienced as a threat to one's safety or to the stability of one's world.(info place)

And several times during touring, The Beatles were assaulted by fans (and detractors) and their lives were threatened so Beatlemania could qualify as a traumatic experience.

 

Though traumatic experiences don't always lead to PTSD so we can't really give an accurate diagnosis of PTSD for George.

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26 June 2015
8.57pm
Necko
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In general, I'm always pretty skeptical of people trying to diagnose people they've never met personally.

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26 June 2015
9.20pm
Ron Nasty
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Beatlemania affected them all to a greater or lesser extent, and that George had the most negative feelings toward the phenomenon is hardly a surprise.

Yet, it seems to me, part of the question asked here collates with the thread about his attitude and feelings about the Anthology project, was George's problem with Beatlemania what made him the increasingly reluctant Beatle as the years went on, and was that because he was suffering from PTSD.

If George suffered from PTSD following Beatlemania it certainly didn't display itself much during the '70s, when he was as active as most, but more active than one. What changed George was John's assassination.

Maybe the question here should be, did the combination of the worst of Beatlemania and John's assassination leave George with PTSD during his last two decades? For that I think there is an argument.

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26 June 2015
9.50pm
Ahhh Girl
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I just saw a headline about post-dissertation stress disorder and post-dissertation depression. Maybe only George (and perhaps Ringo and Paul - not saying they do, just that they would be the only other people who could have it) could have post-Beatles/post-John stress disorder/depression...like RN said.

27 June 2015
2.02am
Annie Music
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JPM-Fangirl said
I'm not so sure George had any form of autism. I do know he was an introvert. I'm the same personality type he was, and I can tell you this: I need to have time to myself! I can be social, I can do the whole crowd thing, and what have you. But the energy I have for those things is very limited and I have to be alone to recharge. When I am forced to stay in social situations too long, I get cranky, impatient, nervous, anxious, sometimes even violent. 

Since the lads had to be "on" all the time when touring, never really a moment to themselves, it's no wonder George became touchy. Even in their hotel rooms, there was always another Beatle around. I can't begin to imagine how mentally drained he must have been! It's no wonder he embraced the eastern spirituality with that much zeal: it was the perfect way for him to shut himself off from the world and really be alone. It probably gave him a lot of energy and peace.

The first part of this is also quite similar to the version of Autism I got. But really it's very complicated and I really don't know. Just wanted to note this

27 June 2015
6.46am
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I can't comment because I'm in no way qualified to diagnose and attribute any medical condition…………….

 

 

 

 

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