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Michael Jackson
23 November 2010
2.22am
GniknuS
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How do you guys feel about the king of pop? I'm surprised his name has never really been brought up here because he's probably the only one with as fascinating of a story as the Beatles with all that happened with his music, his chaotic personal life and even his death which is a pretty interesting subject. I personally love the man's music, I was brought up on the Jackson 5, and Off the Wall and Thriller are still two of my favorite albums. As for his personal life, it's hard to say. I'm reading this book called the Michael Jackson Tapes, which is from this interview he had with his "spiritual guide" and he seems like a pretty misunderstood guy. He says that since he had no childhood, the only people he could really relate to were children because he had no idea how to interact with adults. I also really don't think that those molestation allegations are true, I just think he was taken advantage of. So anyway, does anyone have any thoughts on this tragic icon?

I sat on a rug, biding my time, drinking her wine
23 November 2010
3.03am
mr. Sun king coming together
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First, he's not a tragic icon and secondly he is an okay artist. I like parts of Thriller, but his Come Together Cover was horrendous

I tried to think of something powerful and moving… and failed.  "You were given a choice between war and dishonor - you chose dishonor, and you shall have war" - Winston Churchill
23 November 2010
3.20am
vonbontee
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Well, I definitely prefer his music to the freakshow that was his life, of course.  Thriller is pretty classic, but Off The Wall was better. And actually I prefer a definitive Jackson 5 best-of to either of those, but whatever.

I like black music, disco music. I like the disco music that's out now - John Lennon, 1975
23 November 2010
4.08am
mithveaen
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Well I was a teen when he was a massive star (the 80s) and I like his music, but I'm not a big fan.

Here comes the sun….. Scoobie-doobie…… Something in the way she moves…..attracts me like a cauliflower… Bop. Bop, cat bop. Go, Johnny, Go. Beware of Darkness…  I believe in SH...
23 November 2010
6.01am
GniknuS
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mr. Sun king coming together said:

First, he's not a tragic icon and secondly he is an okay artist. I like parts of Thriller, but his Come Together Cover was horrendous


He may not be an icon to you, but to millions around the world he is the equivalent of the Beatles, to deny that would be silly. And I think it's incredibly tragic what happened to him, no matter how you look at it. Either a) he was horribly taken advantage of or b) he just really lost his way in life despite millions upon millions of dollars and all the fame that one could ask for.
 

I don't listen to his music that much anymore, but I'm still amazed at the incredible talent that this man was. Whenever I hear I Want You Back and realize how young he was when he was singing that song, or listen to his duet with Paul on The Girl is Mine, it's just amazing. I think Paul is about as good of a singer as a white man can expect to get, in terms of pitch and range at least, but Michael just blows him out of the water in that song, and the reality is that he blows just about anyone short of Aretha Franklin, Ella Fitzgerald or Ray Charles out of the water when it comes to singing. And man could that guy dance.

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23 November 2010
6.35am
TheOneBeatleManiac
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GniknuS said:

mr. Sun king coming together said:

First, he's not a tragic icon and secondly he is an okay artist. I like parts of Thriller, but his Come Together Cover was horrendous


He may not be an icon to you, but to millions around the world he is the equivalent of the Beatles, to deny that would be silly. And I think it's incredibly tragic what happened to him, no matter how you look at it. Either a) he was horribly taken advantage of or b) he just really lost his way in life despite millions upon millions of dollars and all the fame that one could ask for.
 
I don't listen to his music that much anymore, but I'm still amazed at the incredible talent that this man was. Whenever I hear I Want You Back and realize how young he was when he was singing that song, or listen to his duet with Paul on The Girl is Mine, it's just amazing. I think Paul is about as good of a singer as a white man can expect to get, in terms of pitch and range at least, but Michael just blows him out of the water in that song, and the reality is that he blows just about anyone short of Aretha Franklin, Ella Fitzgerald or Ray Charles out of the water when it comes to singing. And man could that guy dance.

He was probably the best single artist ever, (probably i'm not sure at all) a-hard-days-night-ringo-8 not passing The Beatles of course, but he was one of the best artists of all time, and i agree with GniknuS, it was an icon. I'm a fan of Jackson, and his death was really tragic for all the fans who loved him. Yeah, he made a lot of mistakes, and had a lot of troubles, but he was a very great, gigantic artist. RIP MJ (1958-2009).
In My Life, I Love You More.
23 November 2010
8.03am
Joe
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Thriller was the second album I ever bought. I grew up when he was a massive star in the 80s, though by the time Dangerous was released I'd largely lost interest.

I still love a lot of his music, and Billie Jean is one of the greatest songs ever recorded. His life was a sorry circus, and it's immensely sad that he didn't know how to take control over it (and was clearly surrounding himself by people who didn't act in his best interests), but he'll live forever in the music that he made in the 60s, 70s and 80s.

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23 November 2010
6.18pm
Zig
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Having been born in 1963, I remember little Michael when he was becoming famous with the Jackson Five in the late 60's / early 70's. I liked his music back then, but as I became older and was exposed to more and more different types of music I found myself growing out of it. However, I was still of the opinion that he had one of the greatest voices ever recorded.

I never liked him as much as I do the Beatles, but I can see why millions did. Ever since the days of Shakespeare, humans loved tragic figures. Lennon and Jackson were certainly that. The only difference was John was able to enjoy at least a few years relatively free of mob scenes wherever he went before the end. I don't believe Michael was as fortunate.

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23 November 2010
6.21pm
TheOneBeatleManiac
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I think on my house where my parents live with my little brother, my father has the Thriller Album on LP. a-hard-days-night-john-6

In My Life, I Love You More.
23 November 2010
8.39pm
RedLennon
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TheOneBeatleManiac said:

I think on my house where my parents live with my little brother, my father has the Thriller Album on LP. a-hard-days-night-john-6


I had two Thriller LPs.  They were both on Ebay about 20 minutes after his death though.

 

I like MJ, he is an amazing artist.  But I also think he is terribly overrated.  If he didn't die last year, I dont think he would be nearly as big as he is right now.  He is probably the best pop artist, but can't cover the genres like The Beatles, or many other bands.

23 November 2010
8.56pm
mithveaen
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You all are right. Michael Jackson is one of the best music artists ever. Period. There's no point to deny that.  Again, I'm not a big fan, but if someone plays his music I'd sing along.

But if we talk about The Man in the Mirror, that's one of my all time favorite songs. It always makes me think about myself and the world.

Here comes the sun….. Scoobie-doobie…… Something in the way she moves…..attracts me like a cauliflower… Bop. Bop, cat bop. Go, Johnny, Go. Beware of Darkness…  I believe in SH...
23 November 2010
8.59pm
mr. Sun king coming together
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mithveaen said:

You all are right. Michael Jackson is one of the best music artists ever. Period. There's no point to deny that.  Again, I'm not a big fan, but if someone plays his music I'd sing along.

But if we talk about The Man in the Mirror, that's one of my all time favorite songs. It always makes me think about myself and the world.


I see many Points to deny it. Sorry if you all think his death was tragic but He Killed himself with drugs and I don't feel bad for people who have millions of drugs and kill themselves because of their addiction.
I tried to think of something powerful and moving… and failed.  "You were given a choice between war and dishonor - you chose dishonor, and you shall have war" - Winston Churchill
23 November 2010
11.31pm
JoB
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He didn't commit suicide. It was an accident.

He had too many things to live for to just throw it all away.

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24 November 2010
12.17am
mr. Sun king coming together
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JoB said:

He didn't commit suicide. It was an accident.

He had too many things to live for to just throw it all away.


he died of an overdose. If he didnt to drugs he would still be here
I tried to think of something powerful and moving… and failed.  "You were given a choice between war and dishonor - you chose dishonor, and you shall have war" - Winston Churchill
24 November 2010
1.11am
JoB
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mr. Sun king coming together said:

JoB said:

He didn't commit suicide. It was an accident.

He had too many things to live for to just throw it all away.


he died of an overdose. If he didnt to drugs he would still be here
 

But it wasn't on purpose. 

His doctor gave him the drugs because he wanted them, they made him feel better about himself and everything. But it wasn't on purpose.

I'd like to be, under the sea, in an octopus's garden, with you.
24 November 2010
3.15am
mr. Sun king coming together
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I DON'T CARE!!! If He asked for the drugs, he is responsible for all occurances during sed period. He took to many and Died. If you die of an overdose, it is your fault. End of Discussion For Me!

I tried to think of something powerful and moving… and failed.  "You were given a choice between war and dishonor - you chose dishonor, and you shall have war" - Winston Churchill
24 November 2010
3.45am
GniknuS
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Coroner releases new details about Michael Jackson's death

With Dr. Conrad Murray officially charged in Michael Jackson's death, the Los Angeles coroner has released the autopsy report that said it was a homicide.

The 51-page report gives vivid detail supporting last August's conclusion that Jackson died from "acute propofol intoxication."

Murray told investigators he gave Jackson propofol, a powerful anesthetic, to help him sleep.

An anesthesiology consultant hired by the coroner to review the findings of the investigation said that "there are NO reports of its use for insomnia relief, to my knowledge," according to the report.

"The only reports of its use in homes are cases of fatal abuse (first reported in 1992), suicide, murder and accident," Dr. Selma Calmes wrote.

"The standard of care for administering propofol was not met," she wrote.

Murray, who was with Jackson when he died, is charged with involuntary manslaughter by acting "without malice" but also "without due caution and circumspection."

Jackson, who hired Murray as his physician while he prepared for what was to have been a series of comeback concerts, called the doctor to his rented Holmby Hills mansion last June 25 at about 1 a.m., the report said.

"The decedent complained of being dehydrated and not being able to sleep," it said.

A police affidavit previously made public said that the doctor told investigators he gave Jackson three anti-anxiety drugs to help him sleep that morning.

Murray told them he had been treating Jackson for insomnia for six weeks at the time of the singer's death. He had given Jackson 50 milligrams of the sedative propofol diluted with the local anesthetic lidocaine every night via an intravenous drip.

The doctor told police he was worried that Jackson was becoming addicted to the drug and was trying to wean him off it.

During the two nights before Jackson's death, Murray said, he put together combinations of other drugs that succeeded in helping Jackson sleep.

Coroner investigators first examined Jackson's body at UCLA Medical Center less than three hours after he was pronounced dead. They used the picture on his California driver's license to confirm it was the singer.

"The decedent's head hair is sparse and is connected to a wig. The decedent's overall skin has patches of light and dark pigmented areas," an investigator wrote.

Jackson suffered permanent hair loss when his scalp caught fire while he was taping a Pepsi commercial in 1984. He was known to wear wigs in public after the mishap.

Jackson's dermatologist, Dr. Arnold Klein, told CNN last year that he had treated Jackson for vitiligo, a skin condition that causes irregular patches of white skin.

Jackson weighed 136 pounds and was 69 inches tall, according to measurements taken during the autopsy the morning after his death.

The front of Jackson's scalp, from his hairline, was tattooed with dark ink over "frontal balding." His eyebrows and the border of his eyelids were also tattooed.

"There is a pink tattoo in the region of the lips," the report said.

The autopsy report noted several broken ribs, apparently suffered during the efforts to revive him.

The autopsy also said that Jackson's left lung was affected by "widespread respiratory bronchiolitis and chronic lung inflammation" that could have had an "adverse health effect." But it was not "considered to be a direct or contributing cause of death," a pathologist hired as a consultant concluded.

Calmes, the consultant, concluded that propofol was administered without the recommended equipment being present, including a "continuous pulse oxymeter, EKG and blood pressure cuff."

Use of the anesthesia requires "full patient monitoring by a person trained in anesthesia," she wrote. Murray is a cardiologist.

"There was no evidence of an infusion pump for control of an IV infusion. No monitors were found at the scene; a blood pressure cuff and portable pulse oxymeter were recovered from a closet in the next room," Calmes wrote.

The consultant said supplemental oxygen "should always be delivered" when propofol is being administered.

An oxygen tank was found near where Jackson slept, but it was empty when the coroner investigator checked it two weeks after Jackson died, Calmes said.

"Multiple opened bottles of propofol were found with small amounts of remaining drug," Calmes said. "A used bottle should be discarded six hours after opening, to avoid possible bacterial growth."

"The levels of propofol found on toxicology exam are similar to those found during general anesthesia for major surgery," Calmes said.

During such surgery, any patient would be "intubated and ventilated by an anesthesiologist," she said.

The consultant's report said the level of lorazepam, a powerful anti-anxiety agent found in Jackson's body, "would have accentuated the respiratory and cardiovascular depression from propofol."

An involuntary manslaughter charge against a physician is a "very unusual thing to see," according to Bruce Cranner, a New Orleans defense lawyer in medical cases.

Cranner said prosecutors may have a "pretty good case" against Murray if they can show he did not take proper precautions when giving Jackson the propofol.

I sat on a rug, biding my time, drinking her wine
24 November 2010
3.52am
mr. Sun king coming together
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Look, trying to convince me of MJ being a poor victim are useless. I believe he did commit the child molestion and I believe that he is a moderately talented singer who has better dance moves than singing ability

I tried to think of something powerful and moving… and failed.  "You were given a choice between war and dishonor - you chose dishonor, and you shall have war" - Winston Churchill
24 November 2010
3.59am
GniknuS
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mr. Sun king coming together said:

Look, trying to convince me of MJ being a poor victim are useless. I believe he did commit the child molestion and I believe that he is a moderately talented singer who has better dance moves than singing ability


Yikes, I wish I was so moderately talented!
I sat on a rug, biding my time, drinking her wine
24 November 2010
4.06am
mr. Sun king coming together
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If you like MJ fine by me. Just stop saying he is this bloody saint. If you think he is talented whatever. Just let me dislike him!

I tried to think of something powerful and moving… and failed.  "You were given a choice between war and dishonor - you chose dishonor, and you shall have war" - Winston Churchill
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