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Is it better to first hear a song when it comes out ... or much later?
30 August 2012
5.40pm
Into the Sky with Diamonds
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GeorgeTSimpson has pointed out in another post how he dislikes the early Beatles.

I find that interesting because in my circles, people either like the Beatles from A-Z, don't care for the Beatles, or like the early Beatles.

The phrases that you hear such as " ... when they were good" or "when they were just a great rock band" refer to the early years. I'm guessing, GeorgeTSimpson, that you don't hear that very often.

I don't know many people who only like the more "sophisticated" years, for lack of a better term.

But I think it just boils down to when you first heard the Beatles. If you were around when they first came about, then it was the early stuff that hooked you, and then you kept liking them as they evolved - or not.

If you heard them later, well then yes, you can pick and choose the styles that you like. 

Which brings us to the topic of this thread.

It's an academic discussion since you have no choice. Either you were around when a famous band was around or you weren't.

So for the fun of it:

Advantages of being present at the release of a song, album, CD:

- you get the benefit of the surprise when something very different comes out. In the U.S., "I Want To Hold Your Hand" was so different that it blew everyone away. Same for "She Loves You." These songs literally changed people's lives, and IMO explains why the Beatles have been so important to so many people for so many years.

Michael Jackson's "Billie Jean" and "Beat It" didn't change any lives, but they fall into that category of wonderful surprise.

- you get the benefit of the buzz that can precede a musical release. Exhibit A? Sgt. Pepper. The anticipation preceding the release of that album was beyond belief and hasn't been matched since (right?) That Sgt Pepper would have not just matched but exceeded these expectations accounts for the fact that still today it's rated #1 on many a list. (The fact that song for song other albums may be better is not the issue.)

On the other hand...

At the time of a song's release, you can't help but be influenced by your general thoughts concerning the artist.

If you think a performer obnoxious/juvenile, or otherwise unlikeable, you'll not be inclined to like his/her songs.

When the Monkees released their first album, I quickly gave it away un-opened. God forbid any of my friends see that album in my room! But in time, I must say, a number of their songs were quite good! (not written by them or completely performed by them of course!)

Likewise, I'm afraid I will NEVER like "Don't Let Me Down" and I doubt it will ever be on my iPod or Spotify list. I can't listen to it without thinking of whom it was written for and under what circumstances.

When you're detached from a song in time and place, you can simply judge it on its merit.

Voila.

Any other thoughts on the matter?

"Into the Sky with Diamonds" (the Beatles and the Race to the Moon – a history)
30 August 2012
6.26pm
Von Bontee
A Hole In The Road
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I'd say that something like 85-90% of the music I've acquired in my life (1000s of records, etc.) has been 5, 10, even 40 years out of date (and rising!) at the time of acquisition, so take that as my answer. I was a teenager in the '80s, and the bulk of my listening was Beatles/Hendrix/Zeppelin and the like. You can possibly count on two hands the occasions where I've anticipated the imminent release of a current performer's new album. Basically, musical recording techniques and technology turned a corner around 1983-84 or so, for the most part, imposing on my ears an impediment to appreciating the music to my full potential. Someday I'll listen to "Flowers In The Dirt" or maybe "Memory Almost Full" and think "Hey, this is a really good record - too bad it couldn't have been recorded in 1974!"

So I guess this is a long-winded way of saying that I don't have the proper ears to answer the question thoughtfully, sorry for wasting everyone's time!

(Actually I'm exaggerating a bit - I do like and own a whole lot of stuff from the mid '80s or earlier. If it's good enough, I can forgive the awful '80s drum sound. But it's no accident that my favourite hip-hop recordings all relied not on drum machines, but on drum SAMPLES recorded 15, 20 years prior.)

One day, a tape-op got a tape on backwards, he went to play it, and it was all "Neeeradno-undowarrroom" and it was "Wow! Sounds Indian!" -- Paul McCartney
30 August 2012
8.00pm
meanmistermustard
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Im an oldie despite not being old and the music i listen to is 95% not of this generation. A lot of that will be down to preconception; i used to have to listen to the main radio stations (mainly namely Clyde 1) and the music was, to me, very dull, listless and repetivite, and that way of thinking is ingrained in my head. The other issue i find is that if anything did come out i liked initially (eg Human by The Killers) i was bombarded by it to the point of severe overkill by the radio (eg Lady Gaga). There is less chance that will happen when its my own choice and i can discover it and appreciate it more.

However i dont like the music simply because its older - would hate to be that prejudiced.

 

Is that answering the question? More than likely not.

 

Personally if its got a massive history (ie a reputation of being an amazing album) then im more inclined to not like it especially if im meant to. Like the whole Oasis thing and the idea that if you love the beatles then you'll love Oasis - i dont see why and most people actually dont.

 

Overall id rather hear it on my own terms regardless of when it was released, i dont get caught up in the hype or history of it all, mainly because thats how everything seems to be presented nowadays ('the next big thing', 'must see/hear', 'the new beatles/michael jackson/madonna/frank sinatra&#39a-hard-days-night-george-10.

 

As for what beatles people tend to prefer; my family nearly all prefer the later years (Help! onwards with some of the early stuff thrown in - maybe GeorgeTSimpson is a long lost relative). They like the 'teenybopper' years.

 

Is that answering the question? More than likely not. So lets try to.

 

So with all that rambling taken into consideration based on the way the media works nowadays its better to hear it later. Any excitement of a new release is killed by overexposure, overhype, and overkill. Back at the time of Pepper there was nothing and it was allowed to grow and swell ("what are they up to?") until everyone was dying to hear it (10 months since Revolver? something like that). Nowadays its leaked on the net 6 weeks in advance and any chance of groundswell is killed.

Don’t make your love suffer insecurities, trade the baggage of self to set another one free. ('Paper Skin' - Kendall Payne)
30 August 2012
8.42pm
mr. Sun king coming together
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When it comes out. If you hear something for the first time 40 years after release (Sgt. Pepper, say) you have 40 years of expectations, and it almost always comes up short. Or, you can expect nothing, and not truly recognize the awesomeness it is or contains. 

ITS:

Into the Sky with Diamonds said
On the other hand...

At the time of a song's release, you can't help but be influenced by your general thoughts concerning the artist.

If you think a performer obnoxious/juvenile, or otherwise unlikeable, you'll not be inclined to like his/her songs.

I'm going to have to say no to this - at least if you're a sensible person. If Justin Bieber put out a masterpiece tomorrow, I'd applaud it. It's asinine to reject an artist without reason.

 

Final thoughts (I'm very jumpy today - excuse this horrible lack of cohesiveness):

I've known both: in fact, I'm eagerly awaiting a new release - Mumford and Sons' Babel, and I'll have many more occasions of waiting eagerly for release dates soon. I think the way to avoid feeling embarrassed by something is to realise that public perception is almost always wrong. In 1964, critics viewed the Beatles as pains in the asses. The head or UA Studios (The Studio of AHDN and Help) thought they'd get a shitty movie. They were in it for the Soundtrack rights. The general public very rarely ever views musicians or music (or the arts in general) in proper context. If you avoid the critics and the people who try to pigeon-hole everything into a narrative, you can still assess current music as easily as older works.

As if it matters how a man falls down.'

'When the fall's all that's left, it matters a great deal.

30 August 2012
9.57pm
meanmistermustard
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mr. Sun king coming together said
When it comes out. If you hear something for the first time 40 years after release (Sgt. Pepper, say) you have 40 years of expectations, and it almost always comes up short. Or, you can expect nothing, and not truly recognize the awesomeness it is or contains. 

ITS:

Into the Sky with Diamonds said
On the other hand...

At the time of a song's release, you can't help but be influenced by your general thoughts concerning the artist.

If you think a performer obnoxious/juvenile, or otherwise unlikeable, you'll not be inclined to like his/her songs.

I'm going to have to say no to this - at least if you're a sensible person. If Justin Bieber put out a masterpiece tomorrow, I'd applaud it. It's asinine to reject an artist without reason.

Final thoughts (I'm very jumpy today - excuse this horrible lack of cohesiveness):

I've known both: in fact, I'm eagerly awaiting a new release - Mumford and Sons' Babel, and I'll have many more occasions of waiting eagerly for release dates soon. I think the way to avoid feeling embarrassed by something is to realise that public perception is almost always wrong. In 1964, critics viewed the Beatles as pains in the asses. The head or UA Studios (The Studio of AHDN and Help) thought they'd get a shitty movie. They were in it for the Soundtrack rights. The general public very rarely ever views musicians or music (or the arts in general) in proper context. If you avoid the critics and the people who try to pigeon-hole everything into a narrative, you can still assess current music as easily as older works.

Even the XFactor and all that TV Talent show crap? I do have preconceptions when it comes to music and what i play or want to hear however if i did hear something of that genre by chance for instance and i did like then id be very happy to be wrong. I wouldnt go anywhere near the Carpenters back catalogue despite the widely held view that they were fabulous; what ive heard (half a greatest hits cd) has been bland, incredibly boring and lacking any hint of excitement.

Don’t make your love suffer insecurities, trade the baggage of self to set another one free. ('Paper Skin' - Kendall Payne)
30 August 2012
10.06pm
mr. Sun king coming together
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Even that crap.You can have expectations, or even preconceived notions. But it's wrong to write someone off and then say a song is bad just because of who it is

As if it matters how a man falls down.'

'When the fall's all that's left, it matters a great deal.

30 August 2012
10.14pm
meanmistermustard
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mr. Sun king coming together said
Even that crap.You can have expectations, or even preconceived notions. But it's wrong to write someone off and then say a song is bad just because of who it is

I wouldnt write it off as bad without hearing it, just wouldnt go anywhere near it without a nudge.

Don’t make your love suffer insecurities, trade the baggage of self to set another one free. ('Paper Skin' - Kendall Payne)
30 August 2012
11.28pm
Dipsy
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mr. Sun king coming together said 

I'm going to have to say no to this - at least if you're a sensible person. If Justin Bieber put out a masterpiece tomorrow, I'd applaud it. It's asinine to reject an artist without reason.

Exactly. I've had a moment very similar to this example about four months ago. I, personally, am in no way a Taylor Swift fan: I almost always cringe at the first listen of her newest songs seemingly written with a middle school mentality (like, "We Are Never Ever Getting Back Together"...really?!). However, I was pleasantly surprised to discover a song called "Safe and Sound" that she collaborated on with The Civil Wars; it was, in a word, beautiful. I may still not like T. Swift's seemingly fake personality during interviews, but I gained a smidgeon of respect for her knowing that she was actually capable of writing and performing (on albums, anyways...) nice songs. And I commended her for it.

I've known both: in fact, I'm eagerly awaiting a new release - Mumford and Sons' Babel, and I'll have many more occasions of waiting eagerly for release dates soon.

I absolutely cannot wait until I can get my hands on that album come September 25th! paul-mccartneyI'm also the type of person who, if I notice that a band hasn't released a new album in a few years, regularly checks their websites and such in anticipation of new material. For example, Villagers is due for a new album (but when...?) that I shall look extremely forward to. I've also bought City and Colour's "Bring Me Your Love" and "Little Hell" on their release dates--after having a 147-day countdown for "Little Hell" lol. a-hard-days-night-george-10

"I'm not going to change the way I look or the way I feel to conform to anything. I've always been a freak. So I've been a freak all my life and I have to live with that, you know? I'm just one of those people."
30 August 2012
11.45pm
GeorgeTSimpson
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There's very few music which is new and which I really like. I love most new mccartney songs and very few modern songs one example is summer paradise by simple plan and sean paul i think imo a nice song (not as great as any beatles or wings song but nice)

Once there was a way to get back homewards. Once there was a way to get back home; sleep pretty darling do not cry. And I will sing a lullaby
30 August 2012
11.51pm
FlyOn13
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I like a lot of modern music... The most beautiful song I've heard in the last year is "The A-Team" by Ed Sheeren...it is SO AMAZING!!!! a-hard-days-night-ringo-10

“I was special. I always have been. Why didn't anyone notice me?" -John Lennon
30 August 2012
11.57pm
Long John Silver
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Yeah that one is great.  Also new song by Muse - Madness :) .

Living is easy with eyes closed, misunderstanding all you see.
31 August 2012
8.25pm
The Walrus
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In my life, I have basically never experienced a "buzz" around a new album. I was too young to get excited about Whatever People Say I Am, That's What I'm Not, by the Arctic Monkeys, which was probably the last album people outside of music critics got really excited about as soon as it was released. I only have a vague awareness of excitement surrounding American Idiot.

As a result, there's no more to get swept away by when I listen to, say, Sweet Heart Sweet Light by Spiritualized, which is my favourite album of the year, than when I listen to a random historical album of similar quality.

I think that might be about to change. In the next few weeks, four of the most popular bands among young people of my age and demographic will be releasing albums. The Vaccines, Mumford and Sons and Two Door Cinema Club will all be releasing their second albums, and Green Day have a new album out as well. Now none of those are particular favourites of mine, but I think my school will be buzzing about at least one of the albums. Who knows, maybe I'll be swept away and talk about Come Of Age in the same way the elderly (joke) talk about Sgt. Pepper, or how middle aged people think of Thriller, or thirty-somethings think of Nevermind or Definitely Maybe. I would be very surprised if any of these upcoming albums are as good as those, and I don't think my kids would understand my excitement.

Erm... TLDR, there's probably something special about the music being made when you are the target audience, which no future generations will understand, but great music is great music.

And I neeeeeeeeed her all the time
31 August 2012
9.49pm
Long John Silver
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I didn't know you were that young... how old were you when debut Arctic Monkey album came out?

Living is easy with eyes closed, misunderstanding all you see.
1 September 2012
12.01am
The Walrus
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I was 10. I didn't listen to the album for years.

And I neeeeeeeeed her all the time
1 September 2012
12.03pm
Into the Sky with Diamonds
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Whoa, meanmisternustard, didn't recognize you. Welcome to the new avatar.

"Into the Sky with Diamonds" (the Beatles and the Race to the Moon – a history)
1 September 2012
5.41pm
meanmistermustard
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Why thanks INTSWD. It was a spur of the moment thing last night but will probably last a day or so before something else comes along and replaces it.

Don’t make your love suffer insecurities, trade the baggage of self to set another one free. ('Paper Skin' - Kendall Payne)
1 September 2012
5.53pm
Long John Silver
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The Walrus said
I was 10. I didn't listen to the album for years.

To me a bigger problem was that I wasn't that much into music as I am today, but I changed a lot in last few years :) .

Living is easy with eyes closed, misunderstanding all you see.
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